WEBVTT 1 00:02:19.640 --> 00:02:21.539 John Compton: Why do I not have… 2 00:02:51.220 --> 00:02:53.610 John Compton: Not… I understand. 3 00:03:21.300 --> 00:03:22.320 John Compton: Whatever. 4 00:05:06.170 --> 00:05:06.725 John Compton: Hey. 5 00:05:07.770 --> 00:05:08.770 Laurel: Hello. 6 00:07:25.660 --> 00:07:27.219 John Compton: All quiet on the… 7 00:07:27.220 --> 00:07:27.540 Peter Nagrod: What? 8 00:07:27.540 --> 00:07:29.840 John Compton: group of friends. Amazing. 9 00:07:29.840 --> 00:07:30.700 Peter Nagrod: I know. 10 00:08:22.430 --> 00:08:23.440 John Compton: Okay… 11 00:09:25.810 --> 00:09:26.380 Peter Nagrod: Nope. 12 00:09:29.390 --> 00:09:30.120 Peter Nagrod: Right. 13 00:10:08.310 --> 00:10:10.030 Peter Nagrod: We're gonna star the what? 14 00:10:11.750 --> 00:10:12.619 John Compton: Or what? 15 00:10:12.620 --> 00:10:18.159 Peter Nagrod: Now it's gonna be 10… now we're gonna be done at 11.32 instead of 11.30. 16 00:10:19.210 --> 00:10:22.299 John Compton: I'm not gonna talk at all, that should cut off an hour. 17 00:10:23.660 --> 00:10:27.160 John Compton: So, are we done? Right. 18 00:10:27.550 --> 00:10:34.840 John Compton: Okay, yes, welcome everyone to the March 9th meeting of the Washington Grove Town Council. 19 00:10:35.430 --> 00:10:41.829 John Compton: First item of business, after calling to order is approval of the agenda. 20 00:10:42.240 --> 00:10:51.530 John Compton: Hopefully the council… Took a look at the agenda, as did everybody else. It's rather long. 21 00:10:51.810 --> 00:10:55.560 John Compton: So, I've made some suggestions here. 22 00:10:55.660 --> 00:11:02.500 John Compton: some, some suggested changes, they're highlighted. You should be seeing the agenda, by the way. 23 00:11:03.090 --> 00:11:07.829 John Compton: Just where I, I, I either changed some wording, but, 24 00:11:08.300 --> 00:11:18.980 John Compton: Under… under item 9, the permit for Operation of Summer in the Parks, I've, listed the discussion to start with some comments from Ava. 25 00:11:19.160 --> 00:11:26.359 John Compton: who's the director of the SITP, she had submitted these as personal parents, but it's more appropriate she 26 00:11:26.690 --> 00:11:28.490 John Compton: Speak at this… 27 00:11:28.920 --> 00:11:39.740 John Compton: agenda point, and she's the director of a program, it's under administrative matters. It's basically, a staff, comment and report. 28 00:11:40.100 --> 00:11:47.890 John Compton: The other thing is that item 15 is the proposal to purchase playground equipment. 29 00:11:48.190 --> 00:12:04.270 John Compton: That one includes a presentation by the playground committee chair, and because we have a March 23rd meeting on, on budget, well, FY27 budget, which includes, of course, the playground, future. 30 00:12:04.270 --> 00:12:10.159 John Compton: future purchases, I'm going to suggest that we just defer this item 31 00:12:10.190 --> 00:12:22.769 John Compton: to the March 23rd meeting in two weeks, when it will fit right in to a discussion of spending, both in fiscal 26 and, of course, the budget for 27. 32 00:12:23.880 --> 00:12:29.630 John Compton: The other alteration, I just put a note here under 16. 33 00:12:29.830 --> 00:12:35.479 John Compton: We… the last item is, this resolution 202602. 34 00:12:37.330 --> 00:12:52.580 John Compton: Which, if it is introduced, we, we may want to, defer discussion, pending some… pending any, any comments from the Council or anyone else to a subsequent meeting. 35 00:12:52.980 --> 00:12:55.860 John Compton: Okay, do I have a motion to approve this agenda? 36 00:12:56.350 --> 00:12:57.630 Peter Nagrod: So, John, I have a question. 37 00:12:57.630 --> 00:12:58.190 John Compton: Sure. 38 00:12:58.190 --> 00:13:17.949 Peter Nagrod: For the, playground equipment, which would be over $20,000, there's… there seems to be two different opinions about whether we need an RFP for that, and if we don't need an RFP, that's great. If we do need one, then we're gonna have to act on this, like, quicker, right? 39 00:13:19.140 --> 00:13:24.510 John Compton: Okay, well, I've expressed the opinion, I, I said it to Oscar in an email. 40 00:13:24.770 --> 00:13:34.530 John Compton: Yeah. Last week, and I guess I've finally sort of copied the Council on it. This isn't the kind of thing that we can actually… 41 00:13:34.850 --> 00:13:39.439 John Compton: Let me back up. If the playground committee has their eyes on a particular piece of equipment. 42 00:13:39.930 --> 00:13:49.630 John Compton: It's not… we're not entertaining alternative pieces of equipment. Then, the best we can do, I mean, in terms of our, 43 00:13:50.020 --> 00:13:57.039 John Compton: You know, a financial oversight is to, Use a vendor's proposal 44 00:13:57.070 --> 00:14:11.380 John Compton: Similar to what we did with the radar speed signs, where a group of council members went out and got, looked into the options, and got proposals from vendors, and basically 45 00:14:11.380 --> 00:14:18.089 John Compton: Presented, the fact that they'd done that, and that they… the one they wanted was this one, and here was why. 46 00:14:18.280 --> 00:14:22.919 John Compton: So, my feeling is that's what we… we… that's really what the playground committee 47 00:14:24.530 --> 00:14:33.299 John Compton: wants to do, if I'm wrong, if they really want to open it up to vendors, but if it's just a, you know, almost a sole source vendor. 48 00:14:33.480 --> 00:14:36.560 John Compton: then I don't see why we would need an RFP. 49 00:14:36.940 --> 00:14:41.039 Peter Nagrod: Right, but it's… but there are other vendors out there that make the same… 50 00:14:41.630 --> 00:14:45.339 Peter Nagrod: It's the same equipment, pretty much. You know, that toy. 51 00:14:45.620 --> 00:14:47.800 Peter Nagrod: So, you know, either one is on… 52 00:14:47.800 --> 00:14:58.850 John Compton: Well, I don't care, I mean, maybe if Council wants to put… to have a RFP put together and distributed to whatever list of, 53 00:14:59.010 --> 00:15:03.060 John Compton: list of, potential vendors, I'm… 54 00:15:03.280 --> 00:15:08.100 John Compton: Not exactly certain what the specifications of the request would be. 55 00:15:08.480 --> 00:15:15.070 John Compton: But, if it's specific enough that, you expect… well, it's up to them. 56 00:15:17.070 --> 00:15:26.399 John Compton: So, okay, we'll leave it on the agenda, and we can always, why don't we go back to that when we get there, and decide how much of that item to do. 57 00:15:26.400 --> 00:15:27.860 Peter Nagrod: Okay, okay, thanks. 58 00:15:27.860 --> 00:15:36.550 John Compton: So we won't strip it at this point, so I'm going to, 59 00:15:37.740 --> 00:15:40.280 John Compton: Here it is. I'll simply take that out. 60 00:15:40.470 --> 00:15:41.370 John Compton: For now. 61 00:15:42.600 --> 00:15:47.420 John Compton: Okay, I still need a motion to approve the agenda now, as… 62 00:15:48.850 --> 00:15:50.810 Peter Nagrod: I'll make the motion to approve of the agenda. 63 00:15:51.030 --> 00:15:52.660 John Compton: Okay. 64 00:15:52.920 --> 00:15:54.000 johnporter: We'll second it. 65 00:15:54.910 --> 00:15:57.800 John Compton: Okay, then, all in favor of approving the agenda. 66 00:15:58.600 --> 00:16:03.710 John Compton: I see a unanimous, oh, even Hutch voted for it. 67 00:16:06.450 --> 00:16:11.140 John Compton: Okay, so… 68 00:16:11.430 --> 00:16:20.449 John Compton: Then, where are we on the agenda? Well, we're on the, approval of minutes. Sorry, I should have taken that out. We don't have minutes, so not available. 69 00:16:20.740 --> 00:16:26.250 John Compton: This is a quick one. There's no minutes to approve as yet. Apologies, I didn't finish. 70 00:16:26.410 --> 00:16:31.450 John Compton: them, entirely. I will have them for the March 23rd meeting in 2 weeks. 71 00:16:34.100 --> 00:16:46.910 John Compton: Okay, next item, then, is up front, and, basically, is, the Council, 72 00:16:47.510 --> 00:16:56.899 John Compton: discussing in advance. Look, we all received quite a few, letters to the mayor and Council. 73 00:16:57.270 --> 00:17:08.089 John Compton: And we're mostly aware of the situation. I'd be happy to summarize, what, what is going on. 74 00:17:08.099 --> 00:17:08.599 Bruce Daggy: Oh. 75 00:17:08.599 --> 00:17:10.939 John Compton: With respect to safety and vandalism. 76 00:17:10.940 --> 00:17:12.149 Bruce Daggy: I've got it, I've got it. 77 00:17:12.329 --> 00:17:13.869 John Compton: Situation. 78 00:17:14.130 --> 00:17:14.510 Bruce Daggy: Oh. 79 00:17:14.510 --> 00:17:24.400 John Compton: So, the big one is that, last Sunday… well, a week from ago, Sunday night, apparently, there were at least 6. 80 00:17:24.920 --> 00:17:33.769 John Compton: Broken windows, discovered in vehicles parked on the street, or readily accessible from the street. 81 00:17:33.910 --> 00:17:42.050 John Compton: And, the insides of the cars were either rummaged, or, in a few cases, further vandalized. 82 00:17:42.660 --> 00:17:47.380 John Compton: So, and then subsequently, there was at least… 83 00:17:48.070 --> 00:17:52.039 John Compton: Possibly one other, situation reported. 84 00:17:52.170 --> 00:17:56.719 John Compton: later in the week, or… I'm not sure whether it was Monday or later in the week. 85 00:17:57.070 --> 00:18:06.850 John Compton: of something similar. Steering column was, was damaged, perhaps in an effort to steal, 86 00:18:07.940 --> 00:18:11.300 John Compton: A piece of equipment from that vehicle, 87 00:18:11.480 --> 00:18:15.919 John Compton: So, there's been a spate of vandalism 88 00:18:16.850 --> 00:18:28.239 John Compton: in the town. And, the issue is what can the town Or, or, the council… 89 00:18:28.420 --> 00:18:42.160 John Compton: do, regarding this. And, so that… that's the first item. There are two other items which I think we can… we can touch on here. One is there… or… and this is fairly… 90 00:18:42.790 --> 00:18:45.470 John Compton: It's infrequent, but routine. 91 00:18:45.680 --> 00:18:56.989 John Compton: where what we think of as vehicles, being on, the town's walkway. So we'll handle that one, after we deal with the, break-in, the vehicle break-ins. 92 00:18:57.360 --> 00:19:01.799 John Compton: And lastly, of course, is the inappropriate use of the tennis courts. 93 00:19:02.350 --> 00:19:04.600 John Compton: Which, 94 00:19:05.080 --> 00:19:15.549 John Compton: the Council requested public input, and we got quite a bit of it. I just have it up here, just to clarify, 95 00:19:15.730 --> 00:19:32.429 John Compton: for everyone who's at this meeting, and I'm sure the Council is well aware of this, that, there are really two issues. The issue that the Council… there's a motion before the Council to approve continuing locking the tennis court gates. 96 00:19:32.880 --> 00:19:39.460 John Compton: The… the issue of, access 97 00:19:39.590 --> 00:19:43.159 John Compton: And use of the tennis courts is not part of that 98 00:19:43.820 --> 00:19:58.970 John Compton: that motion, it's, it's solely, being considered to… as a continued deterrent to… to what I'm going to call misuse of the tennis courts by… 99 00:19:59.280 --> 00:20:00.940 John Compton: by, 100 00:20:02.200 --> 00:20:20.149 John Compton: by residents or visitors who can easily go in and use skateboards and other things on the hard court in particular, and of course, the clay court can be damaged by stuff like that as well. So, there are two things. One is… 101 00:20:20.760 --> 00:20:22.220 John Compton: the tennis court. 102 00:20:23.950 --> 00:20:32.759 John Compton: Protection of the tennis courts. And the other is who gets to use the tennis courts, which is very clearly stated in our ordinances. 103 00:20:33.060 --> 00:20:42.120 John Compton: Although someone pointed out there is somewhat of a discrepancy in our ordinance compendium. 104 00:20:42.420 --> 00:20:53.969 John Compton: But in 2008, and since, the… and prior, the, the use of the tennis courts has been limited to town residents. 105 00:20:55.070 --> 00:20:57.200 John Compton: Okay. 106 00:20:57.950 --> 00:21:04.729 John Compton: All right, so starting with it, going back now to the vehicle break-ins, I'm going to open it up to the Council. I… you know. 107 00:21:05.350 --> 00:21:08.640 John Compton: Frankly, this… this… 108 00:21:09.080 --> 00:21:21.209 John Compton: item is in front of public appearances, because I think the Council has… is… has… has… has read and, knows about the… the scope of the situation, and 109 00:21:21.210 --> 00:21:29.579 John Compton: With that information, as well as other, all the input, I think the Council can discuss it and… 110 00:21:29.650 --> 00:21:35.240 John Compton: Not… not to… you know, not… 111 00:21:35.930 --> 00:21:44.150 John Compton: Spend a lot of time with people making statements about this, because, you know, frankly, many of the people 112 00:21:44.430 --> 00:21:56.990 John Compton: A good many of the names I see at this meeting have expressed their opinion, and I'm certain that the Council is aware of those. Nevertheless, we will have personal appearances after this. 113 00:21:57.120 --> 00:21:57.860 John Compton: Item. 114 00:21:58.690 --> 00:22:06.419 John Compton: Okay, I'm opening up to the Council for their, comments and input on, what? 115 00:22:06.640 --> 00:22:09.539 John Compton: What sort of response? 116 00:22:09.730 --> 00:22:13.540 John Compton: Can we, as the town… 117 00:22:13.740 --> 00:22:16.439 John Compton: government do, and I'm not going to go into 118 00:22:17.370 --> 00:22:24.750 John Compton: Obviously, I could preempt you by saying, you know, we could do X, Y, and Z. I'll let the council speak on that. 119 00:22:24.750 --> 00:22:30.969 Peter Nagrod: John, before you do that, could you, there's been some requests that there's two people on this call. 120 00:22:31.290 --> 00:22:33.959 Peter Nagrod: who… Or not identified. 121 00:22:33.960 --> 00:22:47.130 John Compton: I know, I've indicated they should label their screens, and I'm sorry if you… if you are unable to label your screen, you need to find out how to do it. 122 00:22:47.160 --> 00:22:54.120 John Compton: I did that already 10 minutes ago. They have not changed their names. I can exclude them from the meeting. 123 00:22:54.120 --> 00:23:00.250 Deb Tarasevich: Apologies, I'm one of them. This is Deb Tarasevich, my apologies, I'm a bit of a Luddite, I will do my best to read. 124 00:23:01.390 --> 00:23:03.520 John Compton: I can change it. 125 00:23:04.330 --> 00:23:05.750 John Compton: I'll do it now. 126 00:23:06.010 --> 00:23:06.700 Deb Tarasevich: Thank you. 127 00:23:07.220 --> 00:23:08.909 John Compton: And I'll misspell your name. 128 00:23:10.120 --> 00:23:11.080 John Compton: Almost certainly. 129 00:23:11.080 --> 00:23:12.370 Deb Tarasevich: A deputy will… 130 00:23:12.370 --> 00:23:17.310 Adam Eig: I tried to change my screen name, and it wouldn't let me do it. 131 00:23:17.310 --> 00:23:17.750 Peter Nagrod: Oh. 132 00:23:18.300 --> 00:23:19.150 John Compton: Sorry. 133 00:23:19.150 --> 00:23:22.839 Adam Eig: So, I tried on the thing, and I typed the thing in, and I hit save. 134 00:23:23.750 --> 00:23:26.789 John Compton: Okay, just tell me who you… what name do you want on there? 135 00:23:27.590 --> 00:23:28.600 Adam Eig: Adam Ig. 136 00:23:28.980 --> 00:23:30.789 John Compton: Okay, Adam, thank you. 137 00:23:32.380 --> 00:23:35.480 John Compton: And again, once again, I apologize if I misspelled. 138 00:23:36.130 --> 00:23:38.910 Adam Eig: I'm pretty calm. Oh, no, that's correct. 139 00:23:38.910 --> 00:23:39.820 John Compton: Alrighty. 140 00:23:40.580 --> 00:23:41.660 John Compton: Okay. 141 00:23:41.880 --> 00:23:46.249 Peter Nagrod: Taken care of. So, back to the matter at hand. 142 00:23:47.360 --> 00:24:04.209 John Compton: who's first? Maybe, maybe I'll put, unfortunately for Chris, I'll put him on the spot, since he is the… has taken on the responsibility of the EPSC. In fact, he is the EPSC, and I'm gonna speak directly to all of you people here. 143 00:24:04.390 --> 00:24:10.110 John Compton: You know, this is one of the reasons we want to have an active, you know. 144 00:24:10.210 --> 00:24:13.409 John Compton: safety committee. 145 00:24:13.900 --> 00:24:23.509 John Compton: And yet, we simply don't have anybody, as no one, in spite of asking repeatedly, has spoken up to say that they will participate. 146 00:24:23.570 --> 00:24:30.680 John Compton: On a safety committee, and so we have these incidents. There's much more beyond just 147 00:24:30.700 --> 00:24:44.489 John Compton: reactive or protective things like this. But, you know, I urge some of you to think about whether you can't commit to, one meeting a week. 148 00:24:44.570 --> 00:24:55.160 John Compton: To discuss, Safety issues, for the town. So, Chris, go ahead. 149 00:24:55.370 --> 00:24:59.970 Kriss Grisham: Okay, thanks. So, first, you're saying one meeting a week, it's like… 150 00:24:59.970 --> 00:25:01.529 John Compton: I said month. Oops. 151 00:25:01.530 --> 00:25:19.050 Kriss Grisham: So we're looking for a month right now, but then at one point, we were even thinking every quarter, because there wasn't much going on, but there is a lot going on now, and maybe once a week would be good. So regarding… regarding a couple of the issues that recently occurred in the 152 00:25:19.500 --> 00:25:20.550 Kriss Grisham: the… 153 00:25:20.700 --> 00:25:29.850 Kriss Grisham: the foremost issue are the car break-ins. I did reach out to Officer Romano, and she's with the Montgomery County Public 154 00:25:29.980 --> 00:25:49.030 Kriss Grisham: what's her title? She's the Community Services Officer, and I sent her an email last week. Unfortunately, she was in training, and I didn't hear back from her today. I'm figuring she's trying to catch up on emails. She did also reply a while back regarding 155 00:25:49.470 --> 00:25:53.099 Kriss Grisham: The indecent exposure incidents that's been happening. 156 00:25:53.220 --> 00:26:01.110 Kriss Grisham: And, you know, the message that I got there from her was, you know, that… 157 00:26:01.600 --> 00:26:07.469 Kriss Grisham: They, turned it over to their Special Victims Unit, I think it's called? 158 00:26:08.050 --> 00:26:11.310 Kriss Grisham: And they're investigating. 159 00:26:12.310 --> 00:26:24.280 Kriss Grisham: And so I asked what kind of information they had regarding that vehicle, right? And they're saying that it's a white Toyota or a Mercedes, Hispanic male, dark hair, described as a big guy. 160 00:26:24.400 --> 00:26:27.050 Kriss Grisham: And… 161 00:26:28.490 --> 00:26:43.409 Kriss Grisham: you know, there's been several witnesses, but I guess, you know, if more people could, could, report on… on that, or on whatever else that's happening over the past couple weeks regarding car thefts, 162 00:26:43.960 --> 00:26:46.759 Peter Nagrod: You know, she, she provided a, a. 163 00:26:46.910 --> 00:26:49.139 Kriss Grisham: A non-emergency number to call. 164 00:26:49.300 --> 00:26:53.890 Kriss Grisham: And I could, and in fact, I think I did share that, but I'll share it again. 165 00:26:57.490 --> 00:27:10.969 Kriss Grisham: see if I could even get it on the town website. Regarding trying to get the officers to come out, you know, they are strapped, but because we do have, an increased, 166 00:27:12.330 --> 00:27:18.279 Kriss Grisham: Activity with, with our, vehicle, panelists. 167 00:27:18.440 --> 00:27:28.340 Kriss Grisham: I'm hoping that we could get some… some patrols. But some of the things that… that Officer Romano also mentioned, let me see if I could find what she said, but… 168 00:27:28.450 --> 00:27:37.929 Kriss Grisham: It's something that we probably should be doing also on our own. A lot of people have, you know, your Ring cameras or whatever. 169 00:27:37.930 --> 00:27:51.140 Kriss Grisham: But what she suggested is, you know, obviously reporting anything suspicious immediately to 911, or to the non-emergency number, and it's 301-279-8000. 170 00:27:51.360 --> 00:27:57.219 Kriss Grisham: And then, if you're a victim, or you witness a crime. 171 00:27:57.510 --> 00:28:04.329 Kriss Grisham: to consider reporting it. So it sounds like they're not getting a lot of people reporting these incidents. 172 00:28:04.540 --> 00:28:10.919 Kriss Grisham: The more you get submitted to the police, the more they're gonna realize that this has become a hotspot. 173 00:28:11.200 --> 00:28:15.410 Kriss Grisham: And… what else is there? 174 00:28:17.270 --> 00:28:27.500 Kriss Grisham: And then, you know, she said to just call the police, or to call her, and I could reach out to her, more, and I will tomorrow, to see what she knows. 175 00:28:27.730 --> 00:28:30.340 Kriss Grisham: But that's… that's all I have. 176 00:28:30.830 --> 00:28:34.199 Mary W: Chris, can I ask you a question? Way back, 177 00:28:34.210 --> 00:28:51.170 Mary W: When, I was on the safety committee when it first started, when Patty was chairman, and one of the things we were trying to do at that point was trying to re-enliven a neighborhood watch, which we had had in town, in place where you had blocks and you had a block captain. 178 00:28:51.170 --> 00:29:04.570 Mary W: and kind of a, a structure of reporting and things like that. And, it kind of died when the committee died, but I think it might be worth… worth looking into. I don't know how well it worked 179 00:29:04.570 --> 00:29:06.509 Mary W: It was not in, in… 180 00:29:06.630 --> 00:29:24.759 Mary W: in play when I was here. I don't know if anybody had experiences with that system before, but that is one thing that neighborhoods do, and you can, you know, you can put signs around, say there's a neighborhood watch, which just, you know, shows that there is a little bit more, people taking notice of what's going on. 181 00:29:24.760 --> 00:29:28.210 Kriss Grisham: Yeah, that's true, that's true. Yeah. 182 00:29:28.740 --> 00:29:41.380 Kriss Grisham: And, I mean, we could try to organize that, I think. You know, I heard that, you know, like you were saying, that it was here in the grove for a while, and then when things died down, and there were no incidents, then everybody kind of… 183 00:29:42.060 --> 00:29:53.909 Kriss Grisham: you know, got tired of participating, and then it fizzled away. But now that we have these incidents, and the unfortunate thing is it's happening pretty quick, so it's probably a small group of people. 184 00:29:54.030 --> 00:30:03.740 Kriss Grisham: That are coming through and targeting select vehicles. It sounds like it's, it's the Hyundais, and the Kias. 185 00:30:04.440 --> 00:30:05.450 Kriss Grisham: So… 186 00:30:06.050 --> 00:30:12.090 Kriss Grisham: You know, and again, you know, to deter that right now, until we could get the more police action. 187 00:30:12.370 --> 00:30:24.749 Kriss Grisham: you know, drive-throughs, whatever it might be. And then again, when they do that, it's a hit or miss, right? They could come through, you know, once or twice an evening, and then all that time in between. 188 00:30:25.000 --> 00:30:27.059 Kriss Grisham: A lot could happen. 189 00:30:27.060 --> 00:30:36.900 Mary W: Someone recommended getting the security, service for a period of time. Is that something that… Anybody's ever… 190 00:30:37.420 --> 00:30:37.830 Kriss Grisham: Well. 191 00:30:37.830 --> 00:30:40.979 Mary W: familiar with, or what we could do, I don't know how expensive that is. 192 00:30:40.980 --> 00:30:46.650 Kriss Grisham: Yeah, that's a good point, too. And so, you know, it probably isn't… 193 00:30:46.780 --> 00:30:50.450 Kriss Grisham: Too cheap. But then again, 194 00:30:50.730 --> 00:30:58.180 Kriss Grisham: you know, if the person is on one side of town and something happens on the other side of town, it's not going to do us any good, right? 195 00:30:58.180 --> 00:31:05.319 Mary W: But the presence of knowing that there's some surveillance might be a deterrent of people coming in, you know, if it's the same group. 196 00:31:05.320 --> 00:31:08.780 Kriss Grisham: And that's what I'm… that's what I'm getting at is, you know, a lot of people have 197 00:31:08.990 --> 00:31:14.859 Kriss Grisham: the door ring campus. You know, there's… you know, we could, we could even look into, 198 00:31:15.130 --> 00:31:24.780 Kriss Grisham: pointing up, you know, like, wildlife cameras or something to catch people in action. You know, we've had incidents, a year ago, I think it was, where 199 00:31:24.780 --> 00:31:36.439 Kriss Grisham: There was, crimes of opportunity where people left their car doors open and people were ransacking the cars. Probably young kids, because it sounds like there wasn't any actual damage, just some 200 00:31:37.120 --> 00:31:38.730 Kriss Grisham: Messiness in the cars. 201 00:31:38.730 --> 00:31:39.200 Peter Nagrod: genius. 202 00:31:39.200 --> 00:31:42.630 Kriss Grisham: But… 203 00:31:42.880 --> 00:31:46.830 Kriss Grisham: Yeah, I mean, we… you know, you bring up some… some good points. I mean, we could… 204 00:31:47.020 --> 00:31:54.339 Kriss Grisham: You know, what I was hoping to be able to do, and I'll try to get to the… to Montgomery County Police to see if, for nothing else. 205 00:31:54.590 --> 00:32:10.340 Kriss Grisham: Can we get a squad car just parked in town someplace? You know, they don't have to have it manned, I don't think. You know, but looking for feedback from them is my number one thing right now. What can we do as a community, as a town? 206 00:32:11.750 --> 00:32:15.040 Peter Nagrod: So, Chris, if you're the lead person here. 207 00:32:15.040 --> 00:32:33.339 Peter Nagrod: I personally find this really depressing. I love my town, I've always felt very secure here. I have never… I've been here 42 years, I have never locked my car in 42 years, and I'm thankful these days that I don't, but I don't… you know, that's not the way we should have to live. I'm very unhappy with… 208 00:32:33.480 --> 00:32:40.369 Peter Nagrod: All the, all the listserv comments that have come through, it's been very disjointed, and 209 00:32:40.380 --> 00:32:55.409 Peter Nagrod: it comes across as even more powerful when all these people are giving all this information, and you don't know, you know, what else is happening out there. I know somebody mentioned that there was a car, vandalized recently on Chestnut. That's, Susan, Ulendoff. 210 00:32:55.410 --> 00:33:02.650 Peter Nagrod: I went by, that was her car, and that wasn't even on the listserv. I don't even know if she knows it was vandalized. So, looking at… 211 00:33:02.790 --> 00:33:20.649 Peter Nagrod: some research from ChatGPT, there's… there's a lot of communities out there who have experienced this, and they've dealt with it. And they've… they've created, you know, they've… they've organized their doorbell cameras, there's, you know, security that the town can do. 212 00:33:20.690 --> 00:33:34.900 Peter Nagrod: You know, cameras are cheap, but they say that it needs to be organized, and I think that a combination of what Mary mentioned as far as going back to, you know, having block captains, but 213 00:33:34.920 --> 00:33:52.870 Peter Nagrod: looking more with technology. You know, even for me, I wouldn't mind paying somebody to have a consultant come in and look at what's going on. But just do something that's proactive, because right now, I feel like a victim. And I feel like I get up in the morning, and I'm, like, kind of afraid to look at my car, because I'm afraid that my window might be broken. Normally, this happens once. 214 00:33:52.870 --> 00:34:00.640 Peter Nagrod: and then it's over. But this seems like somebody's very happy coming through the grove. It's almost like somebody has a vendetta, I feel, against the grove. 215 00:34:00.690 --> 00:34:18.499 Peter Nagrod: And I, you know, I really think that we… I appreciate John putting this on the agenda for today, that we actually are talking about this. But, you know, I'd be glad to work with you and whoever else, and maybe we'll have… get some volunteers to help, get the technology going. But, you know, I really think that we need to… 216 00:34:18.710 --> 00:34:30.770 Peter Nagrod: put this, this, you know, because, you know, we're worrying about… we're all doing the town to spend a lot more energy talking about locking a tennis court when, you know, we have something much more serious going on. So… 217 00:34:31.350 --> 00:34:32.610 Kriss Grisham: So, so, so… 218 00:34:32.610 --> 00:34:33.230 Peter Nagrod: Move forward. 219 00:34:33.230 --> 00:34:33.920 John Compton: No, so… 220 00:34:33.920 --> 00:34:34.290 Kriss Grisham: Yeah. 221 00:34:34.290 --> 00:34:36.360 John Compton: Just let me, let me interject. 222 00:34:36.360 --> 00:34:36.860 Peter Nagrod: Sure. 223 00:34:36.860 --> 00:34:39.409 John Compton: Yeah, you know, the, the… 224 00:34:40.940 --> 00:34:50.999 John Compton: There actually… there's a difference in kind between what's going on with… with the… which we're calling… I'm calling vandalism, breaking windows. 225 00:34:51.150 --> 00:34:56.679 John Compton: Before this, there were plenty of space of cars being entered. 226 00:34:56.889 --> 00:35:02.100 John Compton: Generally, they were cars that hadn't been locked, but things were rummaged. 227 00:35:02.270 --> 00:35:02.820 Peter Nagrod: Right. 228 00:35:02.820 --> 00:35:04.760 John Compton: Sometimes damage was done. 229 00:35:04.930 --> 00:35:21.890 John Compton: You know, and so this isn't, you know, the only thing new here is that somebody seems willing to, you know, be destructive, more destructive in their, in their efforts. So, you know, and if that's what's elevating this. 230 00:35:22.180 --> 00:35:37.789 John Compton: all well and good, because it's, you know, a destructive, more destructive. But it's not a new occurrence that we have a, you know, a night or a few nights of breaking into vehicles. 231 00:35:38.050 --> 00:35:42.189 John Compton: That's… I just want to state that as a fact. Okay, back to, comments. 232 00:35:43.560 --> 00:35:50.489 Kriss Grisham: So, so let me, you know, before we go any further regarding technology, you know, to be… 233 00:35:50.640 --> 00:36:01.819 Kriss Grisham: to respond to, Peter. Officer Romano, probably a year ago, provided a website link 234 00:36:02.010 --> 00:36:08.620 Kriss Grisham: that Montgomery County Police has, where you could sign up and register your 235 00:36:08.840 --> 00:36:27.880 Kriss Grisham: you know, cloud-based cameras, where they would have access. The problem with that, when I mentioned it a while back, is people were worried about, you know, Big Brother watching or, you know, surveillance activities. But in this case, it may not be a bad idea to try to 236 00:36:28.000 --> 00:36:30.760 Kriss Grisham: Register your, your, you know. 237 00:36:31.430 --> 00:36:36.899 Kriss Grisham: Cloud-based cameras, so that at least the police would have another tool. 238 00:36:40.650 --> 00:36:53.629 Peter Nagrod: So it seems like we should just… John, why don't we just put, like, a little work group together, instead of talking… we're throwing all this stuff out now, why don't we put a work group together of interested citizens and see what the, you know, what we can do? 239 00:36:53.970 --> 00:36:55.290 Peter Nagrod: And be done with it. 240 00:36:56.150 --> 00:36:58.229 Patrice Klein: reform the EPSC. 241 00:36:58.270 --> 00:36:59.190 John Compton: No. 242 00:36:59.190 --> 00:36:59.990 Peter Nagrod: I'm in. 243 00:36:59.990 --> 00:37:10.549 John Compton: The unfortunate thing is that we, yes, that in the past we have had a… exactly that, which… which the APSE was the… was the one who undertook 244 00:37:10.550 --> 00:37:21.639 John Compton: with this sort of thing. Right now, it's only Chris, so if you're suggesting that, oh, well, if nobody's willing to volunteer, let's, recruit some people to come up with, 245 00:37:22.010 --> 00:37:33.630 John Compton: Come up with, potential responses to, to, to, to increase the, the, you know, to prevent these things from happening as, in the future. 246 00:37:34.180 --> 00:37:38.339 John Compton: So, the answer is… 247 00:37:39.790 --> 00:37:52.420 John Compton: a little bit further, someone can propose that we do that, and maybe that's the thing to do if you're mon… you know, if you want to. Let's hear from the rest of the Council if anybody has anything to say. I've kind of assembled a, 248 00:37:52.820 --> 00:37:53.980 John Compton: a, 249 00:37:55.380 --> 00:38:04.809 John Compton: a document that just sort of, lists some of the things that, I hope you can all see that, if it's big enough. 250 00:38:05.850 --> 00:38:12.970 John Compton: there. We've talked about, I think, these… these responses. 251 00:38:13.460 --> 00:38:31.819 John Compton: number one, it's very critical that we actually know the extent of anything going on around town. So they need to report these incidents, and they can be, you know, some of them should be… many should be reported to the police, but maybe all of them should be reported to the town, which means 252 00:38:31.930 --> 00:38:36.200 John Compton: the town clerk, Any town councilor or the mayor? 253 00:38:36.600 --> 00:38:49.749 John Compton: If something has happened, we really don't know the scope of what's going on unless we hear about it, and the listserv is not an official or any consistent way to do it. 254 00:38:50.230 --> 00:39:05.370 John Compton: Secondly, increased camera surveillance. Chris mentioned that. That's something that, if we had an EPSC, that we'd be, could be explored. Have the police report on, on their actions. Chris has that in. I'm sure we will hear from them. 255 00:39:05.370 --> 00:39:11.510 John Compton: This week, for sure. And what, if anything, and what, if any, advice they would give us 256 00:39:11.510 --> 00:39:27.449 John Compton: Just from that inquiry. But, the other thing to do is have the county police, come out and advise, the town on measures that, could be, implemented to deal with this sort of 257 00:39:28.100 --> 00:39:31.429 John Compton: This sort, these sorts of, 258 00:39:31.650 --> 00:39:39.079 John Compton: Of, matters, from the… from indecent exposure to break-ins, and the like. 259 00:39:39.620 --> 00:39:56.270 John Compton: Hiring a night security has been suggested, another job for a group to explore, and then reactivate a neighborhood watch. It's unclear how effective that was when it was active. It… 260 00:39:57.030 --> 00:40:12.420 John Compton: may have been… it's the kind of thing… it's the kind of thing that you can declare ineffective if things continue on, but if nothing happens, then that's great. And as I recall, the reason the neighborhood watch wasn't maintained 261 00:40:13.120 --> 00:40:15.090 John Compton: Besides, nobody… 262 00:40:15.770 --> 00:40:29.330 John Compton: having the responsibility to… to keep it alive was that there were… didn't seem to be a lot of motivation and other reasons to do it. But now we have… we have the good reason to, 263 00:40:29.370 --> 00:40:39.570 John Compton: to reinstitute that. Peter has also suggested, and I put it down, is find out What? 264 00:40:40.200 --> 00:40:40.990 John Compton: What? 265 00:40:41.300 --> 00:40:42.400 John Compton: Neighbor. 266 00:40:45.000 --> 00:40:46.520 John Compton: communities do. 267 00:40:50.820 --> 00:40:51.680 Peter Nagrod: Okay. 268 00:40:52.570 --> 00:41:11.500 John Compton: Okay, that's just a summary, so that, in light that Peter's suggesting, well, we need a group of… group to explore and… and pursue, response to this. So I'm gonna… I'm gonna say that the police report on the actions, Chris is getting them, and he will report on that. 269 00:41:13.410 --> 00:41:22.169 John Compton: All the other ones, need to be, implemented. I would say that, you know, having the county police advise residents, 270 00:41:22.340 --> 00:41:31.359 John Compton: this… this could be just generally a good thing to do periodically. We haven't done this in a while, so this may be a no-brainer. 271 00:41:32.240 --> 00:41:44.149 John Compton: residents record all incidents, I'll put a note in the bulletin, I can put out a Grove Alert. I can't make people take the time to, do a… to report. 272 00:41:44.280 --> 00:41:51.999 John Compton: Other than that, a group certainly can look at… there may be a raft of other things that can be done. So, 273 00:41:52.410 --> 00:42:00.420 John Compton: Does that mean, we have a notion to create a group, or, what's that, Peter? 274 00:42:00.420 --> 00:42:04.820 Peter Nagrod: Yeah, I'd like to make a motion that we create a group to look into this. 275 00:42:05.070 --> 00:42:05.640 John Compton: Okay. 276 00:42:05.960 --> 00:42:07.559 John Compton: Do we have a second on that? 277 00:42:09.230 --> 00:42:10.820 Mary W: I'll second it, Mary. 278 00:42:11.600 --> 00:42:25.319 John Compton: Okay, Mary. So, it's, is there any discussion about that? And, after we act on this, I'll ask for volunteers from, in fact, anyone here. 279 00:42:25.540 --> 00:42:27.170 John Compton: the Council. 280 00:42:28.290 --> 00:42:41.490 John Compton: So, Patty, I can't… we're not going to get into a discussion from residents on this issue, at this time, so I'm gonna have to pass you by. 281 00:42:43.230 --> 00:42:45.010 John Compton: So, discussion on the motion. 282 00:42:45.680 --> 00:42:50.370 johnporter: So, this is John Porter. Is this a new group, or an adjunct to Chris's group? 283 00:42:51.100 --> 00:42:52.730 johnporter: Chris's responsibility. 284 00:42:52.730 --> 00:42:53.460 John Compton: have a group. 285 00:42:53.570 --> 00:42:56.220 John Compton: What? It is a new group. 286 00:42:57.380 --> 00:43:04.470 johnporter: Why are we not giving this responsibility to Chris and have all these people who want to be in that group be as part of his committee? 287 00:43:04.950 --> 00:43:06.819 John Compton: Well, he would definitely be on it, if that's 288 00:43:08.170 --> 00:43:11.860 John Compton: I mean, he doesn't have a group. We're trying to get him a group. 289 00:43:12.580 --> 00:43:14.460 johnporter: No, but you're calling it a new group. 290 00:43:15.120 --> 00:43:15.900 johnporter: So, I don't know. 291 00:43:16.120 --> 00:43:18.099 Peter Nagrod: Call it a new group? It is a new group. 292 00:43:18.260 --> 00:43:24.910 Peter Nagrod: Well, it's just a… but it's not a committee, though, it's a work… it's just a work group for one specific problem. 293 00:43:24.910 --> 00:43:31.010 John Compton: It could turn into a regular committee, if that's what, John, if that's what you're suggesting, and we used to have one, and we have all the mechanisms. 294 00:43:31.010 --> 00:43:31.370 Peter Nagrod: Why? 295 00:43:31.370 --> 00:43:31.980 John Compton: U.S. 296 00:43:32.090 --> 00:43:35.889 John Compton: You're right, but we… nobody's spoken up to join… 297 00:43:35.890 --> 00:43:41.049 Peter Nagrod: Chris can… so let's be… we'll do a stealth way, we'll do a backdoor way, and Chris can run this… 298 00:43:41.220 --> 00:43:44.049 Peter Nagrod: Chris can run the group, and we'll call it something different, that's all. 299 00:43:46.520 --> 00:43:57.009 Kriss Grisham: Well, I think… so… so regarding this group, though, I mean, we could… no matter what we call it, I mean, there's… there's an, you know, immediate need, right? So, 300 00:43:57.330 --> 00:44:11.409 Kriss Grisham: Yeah, I want to be able to provide, and I'll work with John to figure out how to get information out to the town residents with what I find as feedback from the Montgomery County Police. 301 00:44:11.580 --> 00:44:13.199 Kriss Grisham: And, you know, I… 302 00:44:13.200 --> 00:44:20.040 Mary W: I will try this this year. I've been trying since last year, I guess, to get the Montgomery County Police to come out. 303 00:44:20.040 --> 00:44:30.869 Kriss Grisham: And if, for nothing else, just to provide us safety topics, but at least with this one here, we could ask them for specifics on vandalism and car safety. 304 00:44:31.020 --> 00:44:34.340 Kriss Grisham: And then, you know, they are willing to come out. 305 00:44:34.480 --> 00:44:42.479 Kriss Grisham: they're limited on when they can't come out, that's the only other problem. You know, they have families and kids in school and that type of thing, so… 306 00:44:42.830 --> 00:44:47.780 John Compton: But we can definitely get them to come out. I don't think that's in question, it's just a matter of when. 307 00:44:47.780 --> 00:44:55.640 Kriss Grisham: Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, I was trying to get them to come out for our 730 Town Council meetings, and they're saying that, you know, that would be difficult. 308 00:44:56.130 --> 00:44:58.670 John Compton: We can do a separate session later. 309 00:44:59.040 --> 00:45:01.360 Peter Nagrod: But we have a motion out, and we're, like… 310 00:45:01.360 --> 00:45:03.560 John Compton: No, I'll add… we're discussing. 311 00:45:03.560 --> 00:45:03.980 Peter Nagrod: Yeah. 312 00:45:03.980 --> 00:45:06.850 John Compton: Any comments on, on, on, on… 313 00:45:06.850 --> 00:45:10.470 Barbara: assigning a committee to this. Barbara? I support the idea. 314 00:45:10.680 --> 00:45:11.769 John Compton: Okay, thank you. 315 00:45:12.600 --> 00:45:23.440 John Compton: All right, if there are no further comments, well, get from the Council, all in favor of, recruiting and appointing your group. I see, three… Mary, I can't see you. I assume you're in favor. 316 00:45:23.650 --> 00:45:33.609 John Compton: And Rob, by the way, Rob is missing in action because he had to make a work trip for depositions, the life of a roaming lawyer. 317 00:45:33.610 --> 00:45:34.320 Peter Nagrod: - 318 00:45:34.320 --> 00:45:36.169 John Compton: So, John, your vote was… 319 00:45:37.820 --> 00:45:54.389 John Compton: Okay, all right, so that's approved. So, all right, now let me open it to volunteers, and that would be anybody who's here, including, especially residents, and… and Chris is going to, you know, you know. 320 00:45:55.100 --> 00:45:57.720 John Compton: take… Be part of this. 321 00:45:57.830 --> 00:46:03.289 John Compton: So, do we have another council member, or others who are at this, 322 00:46:03.610 --> 00:46:04.169 Peter Nagrod: I'll be honest. 323 00:46:05.120 --> 00:46:07.739 John Compton: You've, so Peter's going to… 324 00:46:07.960 --> 00:46:15.409 John Compton: join the, the Brain Trust, and Patty, you're willing to go on? Okay. 325 00:46:15.410 --> 00:46:20.780 Peter Nagrod: Is it only two counselors, or can it be, does that matter? No, it's just a work group, right? So… 326 00:46:20.780 --> 00:46:24.479 John Compton: Yeah, it's a work group. It can be more than 3, otherwise it's a… 327 00:46:24.480 --> 00:46:27.480 Peter Nagrod: Okay, so there's only two so far, so I'm not taking anybody's spot. Okay. 328 00:46:28.130 --> 00:46:28.929 Peter Nagrod: Hint, hint. 329 00:46:29.930 --> 00:46:32.139 Howard Harary: Our non-council members welcome? 330 00:46:32.500 --> 00:46:36.160 John Compton: Yes, that's what I'm saying. Anyone here at the meeting… 331 00:46:36.160 --> 00:46:36.940 Howard Harary: Good day. 332 00:46:37.590 --> 00:46:39.230 John Compton: Howard, Howard, how are you? 333 00:46:39.430 --> 00:46:40.510 John Compton: Thank you. 334 00:46:40.710 --> 00:46:44.279 Howard Harary: I… this is Howard. Howard Terrari, I volunteer. 335 00:46:44.790 --> 00:46:45.420 John Compton: Thanks. 336 00:46:47.670 --> 00:46:58.159 John Compton: Alright, well, that's kind of a core group of three… four, sorry, I could reach out. 337 00:46:58.160 --> 00:46:59.090 Sylvie Favret: And volunteer. 338 00:46:59.090 --> 00:46:59.929 Peter Nagrod: Oh, so many. 339 00:47:00.440 --> 00:47:01.669 John Compton: Sorry, who was that? 340 00:47:02.370 --> 00:47:03.540 Sylvie Favret: Sylvie. 341 00:47:03.850 --> 00:47:06.029 John Compton: Oh, so many. Thank you. Good. 342 00:47:10.780 --> 00:47:12.809 John Compton: Oh, and Adam. 343 00:47:12.970 --> 00:47:13.320 John Compton: Yeah. 344 00:47:13.700 --> 00:47:15.339 John Compton: In the chat here, Eva. 345 00:47:15.620 --> 00:47:17.500 John Compton: Alright, so we've got Adam Hogue. 346 00:47:18.880 --> 00:47:28.379 John Compton: Okay, that's great. That's 6. So, that'll… that'll get us started, and the idea is to focus on the current 347 00:47:30.300 --> 00:47:38.010 John Compton: oriented issues. By the way, the Emergency Preparedness and Safety Committee had a broader 348 00:47:38.270 --> 00:47:48.709 John Compton: broader involvement, because emergency preparedness is a whole separate thing. We have a… we have a generator at the hall because of their recommendation. 349 00:47:48.820 --> 00:47:57.989 John Compton: We are, well coordinated with the county's, hazard mitigation, plans, for 350 00:47:58.270 --> 00:48:07.440 John Compton: Anything from train derailments to, you know, civil emergencies, or, much more likely, weather-related 351 00:48:07.620 --> 00:48:18.629 John Compton: you know, damage. So, the EPSC has a broader scope than what this, group, but, but maybe they'll just ease into 352 00:48:19.040 --> 00:48:21.440 John Compton: Into, that as well. 353 00:48:22.670 --> 00:48:23.730 John Compton: Alright. 354 00:48:24.090 --> 00:48:29.589 John Compton: Any final comments from the Council? We'll move on, in the agenda. 355 00:48:31.710 --> 00:48:32.390 John Compton: Okay. 356 00:48:33.370 --> 00:48:35.060 John Compton: Fine, you do. Alright. 357 00:48:35.300 --> 00:48:50.850 John Compton: Okay, that brings us to public appearances. I guess I should make a comment. There was a lot of input… oh, no, it doesn't bring us to public appearances. It brings us to vehicles on walkways. The next stop, I'm on the safety and vandalism. 358 00:48:51.300 --> 00:48:57.820 John Compton: item. You know, I tried to summarize it in, in, in, . 359 00:48:57.820 --> 00:49:03.319 Kathy Lehman: To point out, this is not, the first time this has happened, won't be the last time it has happened. 360 00:49:03.360 --> 00:49:09.489 John Compton: If we don't think our signage is clear enough, we can do something about on the walkways. 361 00:49:09.970 --> 00:49:13.640 John Compton: I do recall somebody complaining that 362 00:49:13.800 --> 00:49:17.980 John Compton: Contractor vehicles were on the walkways. 363 00:49:18.640 --> 00:49:24.599 John Compton: in… In fact, contractor vehicles are supposed to get permission 364 00:49:24.730 --> 00:49:43.029 John Compton: to be on the walkways, but that's perfectly in line with our policy, because backyards, or front yards in many cases, can only be accessed from the walkways, so temporary use of the walkway for vehicles 365 00:49:43.030 --> 00:49:50.310 John Compton: is permitted, but it should be done, with permission. I'm the one to contact. 366 00:49:50.440 --> 00:49:58.920 John Compton: Same with utility trucks. As you know, PEPCO goes out there and repairs stuff and sometimes damages the walkway. 367 00:49:59.250 --> 00:50:01.480 John Compton: WSSC, and Hawaii. 368 00:50:02.090 --> 00:50:08.020 John Compton: So, if the Council wants to say anything else about that issue, now's the time. 369 00:50:10.100 --> 00:50:14.509 John Compton: Okay, great. So the last issue I put up here, 370 00:50:14.510 --> 00:50:24.679 Peter Nagrod: Just because it's in… So, I'm not sure what just happened just now. So you're saying that if you have a contractor doing work on your house, they need to get permission 371 00:50:24.900 --> 00:50:30.130 Peter Nagrod: to drive on the walkways. But he needs to get permission to drive on the walkways. 372 00:50:30.130 --> 00:50:38.249 Kathy Lehman: And they don't need to sit on the walkway all day long, they can take their job somewhere else. Well, that's part of the point, is you go in, you do what you need to do, and you get out. 373 00:50:38.510 --> 00:50:46.639 John Compton: It's not a parking area. Even if, you know, even if, you know, there's a renovation going on at your house. 374 00:50:46.860 --> 00:50:50.620 John Compton: The walkways aren't a parking area, they are for access of equipment. 375 00:50:50.740 --> 00:50:55.459 John Compton: And, specialty, you know, stuff, so… 376 00:50:55.560 --> 00:50:57.289 Peter Nagrod: Okay. Thank you. 377 00:50:57.740 --> 00:51:07.629 John Compton: Right. I guess I can try and remember to put that in the bulletin as well as a reminder. It comes up periodically, because there are offenders. 378 00:51:07.810 --> 00:51:09.209 John Compton: As we all know. 379 00:51:09.890 --> 00:51:19.649 John Compton: All right, now we have the inappropriate use of the tennis courts, which we're going to address as, 380 00:51:19.890 --> 00:51:28.919 John Compton: As part of the, the motion that is on the, being, being, had been deferred till this month. 381 00:51:29.150 --> 00:51:32.209 John Compton: So, and that's it! 382 00:51:33.120 --> 00:51:36.060 John Compton: So, we can move on to, 383 00:51:36.360 --> 00:51:39.869 John Compton: Public appearances. So, here we are with public appearance. 384 00:51:42.250 --> 00:51:45.690 John Compton: Okay, Eva, if this is about some marks. 385 00:51:45.980 --> 00:51:50.810 John Compton: I've moved you to the item on Summer in the Parks. Yes. Because you're the director. 386 00:51:50.880 --> 00:51:52.630 Eva: It's not about that, it's something else. 387 00:51:52.630 --> 00:51:53.110 Peter Nagrod: No. 388 00:51:53.110 --> 00:51:53.960 John Compton: Okay, great. 389 00:51:54.340 --> 00:52:12.930 Eva: So, yes, so I know I'm going to be talking about Summer in the Parks and, that we need to get licensed and permitted a little bit later in the meeting, but this issue that we have been running an unlicensed summer camp for many, many years brought up to me 390 00:52:13.220 --> 00:52:28.350 Eva: something that I have thought for a long time, and I know other residents have thought, which is that we need to strongly consider hiring a paid town manager, someone who is a professional with experience running a government body. 391 00:52:28.550 --> 00:52:47.009 Eva: who can make sure that we are running our government effectively, efficiently, and in regulation with the county and the state. I really feel like if we had had a town manager, that this would not have happened, that Summer in the Parks would not have gone unregulated and unlicensed for so long. 392 00:52:47.010 --> 00:52:49.180 Eva: So… 393 00:52:49.180 --> 00:53:00.289 Eva: you know, I don't know what there is in the budget for hiring a town manager. I do know we are hiring a new town clerk, and a potential option would be to 394 00:53:00.380 --> 00:53:16.869 Eva: make that role both town clerk and more of a town manager type of position. I've already put this in writing, and I gave some suggested language that you could add to the job description. I just feel like, you know, we're a town run by volunteers. 395 00:53:16.870 --> 00:53:32.009 Eva: And sometimes that means the volunteers, and I'm including myself in this, do not have the knowledge and expertise necessary to correctly run things, and I would just like to see more oversight from a professional with experience 396 00:53:32.170 --> 00:53:45.690 Eva: And so that's something… I strongly encourage the Council to read my written public appearance, and you can see some of my suggestions for the job description, and I will talk more about the Summer in the Park situation when it's my turn to do so. Thank you. 397 00:53:48.290 --> 00:53:49.529 John Compton: Okay, thank you, Eva. 398 00:53:51.240 --> 00:53:54.010 John Compton: All right, anybody else for public appearance? 399 00:53:54.910 --> 00:54:07.139 Eva: Oh, sorry, Paul also wants a public appearance, so he told me that I needed to bring the meeting to him. So, if anybody else wants to go while I'm getting him, but, he's right upstairs. 400 00:54:08.650 --> 00:54:10.140 Eva: Yeah, it's your turn. 401 00:54:10.680 --> 00:54:12.030 Eva: Okay, here he is. 402 00:54:13.560 --> 00:54:14.570 Kathy Lehman: Hi. 403 00:54:15.520 --> 00:54:25.049 Eva: I just wanted to, kind of follow up on some of the things Eva was saying. I sent in a letter, to the Council. The main thing being that, 404 00:54:25.480 --> 00:54:28.440 Eva: In light of the, 405 00:54:29.300 --> 00:54:47.710 Eva: the permitting issue, it seems to me that it's not really clear what liability volunteers are taking on themselves when, you know, we volunteer on committees. And in the letter I gave as an example, you know, it's clear, I think, that if, someone in bad faith does something that causes harm. 406 00:54:47.710 --> 00:55:04.109 Eva: to town property or individual that that person's liable, I would think. But, you know, in a situation where someone's acting in good faith on behalf of the town or a committee, it's not always clear what constitutes a liability, and who's liable, and so… 407 00:55:04.120 --> 00:55:08.869 Eva: You know, for example, with some of the camps, somewhere in the parks. 408 00:55:08.940 --> 00:55:27.610 Eva: you know, for example, who's responsible, or who's liable if someone gets hurt? And then also, you know, who's responsible for making sure that all the regulations are actually satisfied. So, you know, I'd personally like to understand better, kind of, where these liabilities lie. I think it would help if 409 00:55:27.650 --> 00:55:30.960 Eva: The Council could give sort of an official. 410 00:55:31.100 --> 00:55:37.709 Eva: statement to this effect, or clarify this, especially for people on committees. And, yeah, that's… that's the main thing. 411 00:55:40.220 --> 00:55:46.150 John Compton: Okay? We have Paul's letter. We'll refer to it in the minutes for this meeting. 412 00:55:46.460 --> 00:55:51.830 John Compton: Although you can read it on… no, you can't. I didn't put it in the material for this meeting. 413 00:55:52.930 --> 00:55:58.449 John Compton: Christine will probably post it when she gets back from vacation. 414 00:56:01.150 --> 00:56:06.749 John Compton: All right, I think, Oscar, you had your hand up. Did you have something other than playground stuff? 415 00:56:07.060 --> 00:56:10.889 Oscar Ramos: Yeah, yeah, just a question, really. I guess kind of going off with, 416 00:56:10.890 --> 00:56:28.080 Oscar Ramos: even Paul's question about regulations and making sure that, you know, we make decisions, I just want to make sure that the decisions we make are in line with what's allowed. On the task force thing, I don't want to make a big deal out of it, but I honestly just have a question, which is, you know, we change our ordinances to restrict access. 417 00:56:28.220 --> 00:56:29.560 Oscar Ramos: Can we do that? 418 00:56:29.640 --> 00:56:54.089 Oscar Ramos: I just want to make sure that that's something that we can do. As far as the lake goes, I know the lake has a state carve-out to that. You know, just think about how we have access to parks outside the Grove, you know, and we don't pay taxes there. And I know we're a small town, small tax base, I understand we have to balance the access and the maintenance. I just had a factual question, just when we made that decision, did we go through the regulations and just understand that that's an option that we have? 419 00:56:54.260 --> 00:56:58.320 Oscar Ramos: As… just asking if you can talk us through that when we get to that point at some point. 420 00:56:58.720 --> 00:57:02.519 John Compton: You're asking whether we can restrict to residents. 421 00:57:02.870 --> 00:57:03.900 Oscar Ramos: Yeah, yeah. 422 00:57:05.270 --> 00:57:17.750 John Compton: without actually looking up the authority that allows us to do that, I would categorically say we can. State of, I mean, the city of Gaithersburg does, in a number of respects, 423 00:57:18.000 --> 00:57:24.350 John Compton: And other cities as well, I believe, in different, in different circumstances. 424 00:57:24.840 --> 00:57:26.190 Peter Nagrod: So. 425 00:57:26.460 --> 00:57:29.150 John Compton: And, and to tell you the truth, if you, if you've… 426 00:57:29.630 --> 00:57:32.970 John Compton: If you go back through ordinances of the past. 427 00:57:33.000 --> 00:57:50.710 John Compton: There is a… there at one point was a statement that, well, it's in the, whoever found that, Jonathan Dale may have found it, in our, nuisances and, and, don't ask me why it's under nuisances, Article 1. 428 00:57:50.820 --> 00:57:56.709 John Compton: It's a categorical statement that all facilities in town are for the use of residents and their bona fide guests. 429 00:57:58.250 --> 00:57:59.130 John Compton: Period. 430 00:57:59.830 --> 00:58:02.820 John Compton: So, the answer's, yes, we can do it. 431 00:58:03.100 --> 00:58:08.269 John Compton: The question is, do we want to do it? And in what circumstances might we? 432 00:58:08.730 --> 00:58:15.099 John Compton: Restrict, you, you mentioned this, the, the two I know of. 433 00:58:15.460 --> 00:58:19.340 John Compton: And that's the lake and the tennis courts. 434 00:58:19.690 --> 00:58:20.989 John Compton: Where there's a restriction. 435 00:58:22.600 --> 00:58:24.230 John Compton: Any other personal parents? 436 00:58:25.870 --> 00:58:33.439 John Compton: Okay, we'll call the personal appearances, to a close, and go on to, the Treasurer's report. 437 00:58:33.730 --> 00:58:37.690 John Compton: We have Gene here, and we have a treasurer's report. 438 00:58:38.960 --> 00:58:40.240 Jean Moyer: Up and coming. 439 00:58:43.020 --> 00:59:02.639 Jean Moyer: I don't have a lot to say in the interest of time. That's part of the reason I put the notes in off on the right of items that I think might generate a question. I do want to point out under municipal buildings. 440 00:59:02.750 --> 00:59:09.310 Jean Moyer: As we are all aware, all our electric bills went up Quite high recently. 441 00:59:09.590 --> 00:59:13.300 Jean Moyer: With the cold temperatures, so we… 442 00:59:13.370 --> 00:59:30.209 Jean Moyer: We'll run over budget on gas and electricity for the municipal buildings, which covers the hall and the garage. We do heat the garage at a very low temperature, just so the pipes don't freeze, but we do heat it. 443 00:59:30.210 --> 00:59:39.059 Jean Moyer: So I expect by the end of the year, we'll be well over budget due to the cold weather. 444 00:59:39.670 --> 00:59:49.889 Jean Moyer: And, as well as the snow and ice removal, and we'll be bumping that up in the next, budget to 445 00:59:50.030 --> 01:00:06.629 Jean Moyer: In anticipation of continued bad snowstorms. In the Conservation Meadow Grant, we have gone through Phase 2 on that. We've used up all but $1,100 of that grant. 446 01:00:06.630 --> 01:00:14.129 Jean Moyer: I see Bruce Dagge is on the meeting, and we will make sure that that gets used up so we don't have to give it back. 447 01:00:14.250 --> 01:00:18.670 Jean Moyer: The plans are to utilize, 448 01:00:18.980 --> 01:00:38.849 Jean Moyer: I believe, if I… correct me if I'm wrong, staff from Parks and planning to tackle some, invasive species and, get that money used up, otherwise we'll have to hand back a little bit. And that is all I was going to point out. 449 01:00:39.450 --> 01:00:41.120 Jean Moyer: Open to questions. 450 01:00:42.420 --> 01:01:00.089 Peter Nagrod: I don't have a question, Jean, but, John, I just want to say that I've worked on a lot of the committees going through the budgets, and this year, Jean has done an amazing job at educating all of us and teaching us how to be proactive so that 451 01:01:00.460 --> 01:01:16.119 Peter Nagrod: people like you, John, don't… like, last year, I lost… almost lost all of our Gateway, money, because we weren't being proactive. And I really… I think we all really appreciate what Gene's doing, and I think it's really making life a lot easier for all of us, so thank you. 452 01:01:16.400 --> 01:01:22.369 Jean Moyer: And, I guess that can segue into the budget timeline, thank you. 453 01:01:22.860 --> 01:01:41.370 Jean Moyer: The Council will be meeting on the 23rd, I believe it is, John, on your timeline for the work session. John has been… John and I have gone over the first draft of the budget. I'm waiting for John to give me some further edits. 454 01:01:41.560 --> 01:01:44.500 Jean Moyer: Hint, hint, John, we need to get together. 455 01:01:44.500 --> 01:01:45.569 John Compton: I'm aware. 456 01:01:45.860 --> 01:01:51.240 Jean Moyer: And, if there are… what my plan is, 457 01:01:51.510 --> 01:02:04.970 Jean Moyer: If there are changes to requested budgets, is to communicate those back to the people who requested those budgets before the 23rd meeting, and then, 458 01:02:05.020 --> 01:02:14.109 Jean Moyer: If you're on a committee and you don't like that we changed the budget you wanted, you can talk to your council liaison. 459 01:02:14.360 --> 01:02:22.430 Jean Moyer: And, be sure, to have your commentary, 460 01:02:22.890 --> 01:02:29.070 Jean Moyer: Ready for the, the, council member to, bring forth at the workshop. 461 01:02:32.450 --> 01:02:40.220 John Compton: Yeah, thank you. You should be looking at the, at the timeline, the checked-off things are passed. 462 01:02:40.460 --> 01:02:46.309 John Compton: The next one is a Grove Alert concerning the Town Council budget work session. 463 01:02:46.500 --> 01:02:58.710 John Compton: I will attach the mayor's draft, I think, and, hopefully not set off a firestorm over… over any edits, anybody, if you… 464 01:02:59.250 --> 01:03:03.179 Jean Moyer: John, if you can get your draft to me… 465 01:03:03.180 --> 01:03:05.569 Kathy Lehman: a few days ahead of that, I can. 466 01:03:05.570 --> 01:03:06.380 Jean Moyer: Alert. 467 01:03:06.580 --> 01:03:08.559 Jean Moyer: said certain people. 468 01:03:08.560 --> 01:03:11.819 John Compton: Yeah, that's the best way to do it, is… 469 01:03:12.140 --> 01:03:15.320 John Compton: Let's, like, talk before reacting now. 470 01:03:15.730 --> 01:03:16.300 Jean Moyer: Yep. 471 01:03:18.110 --> 01:03:18.890 John Compton: Okay. 472 01:03:20.010 --> 01:03:22.509 John Compton: Any questions about the budget process, then? 473 01:03:25.950 --> 01:03:28.340 John Compton: All right, great. Thank you, Gene. 474 01:03:31.750 --> 01:03:34.430 John Compton: We need a motion to accept the Treasurer's report. 475 01:03:38.090 --> 01:03:39.540 John Compton: Nobody wants to accept the. 476 01:03:39.540 --> 01:03:41.940 Peter Nagrod: Motion to accept the Treasurer's report. 477 01:03:41.940 --> 01:03:45.220 johnporter: You just beat me to it, Peter. Oh, you can second it. 478 01:03:46.000 --> 01:03:47.150 johnporter: Not fast enough at my… 479 01:03:47.150 --> 01:03:49.640 Peter Nagrod: I waited! I was waiting for somebody else to say something. 480 01:03:51.070 --> 01:03:55.209 John Compton: Okay, John has seconded any kind of further comment. All in favor? 481 01:03:57.220 --> 01:04:00.420 John Compton: No opposed? All right, that passes 5-0. 482 01:04:00.920 --> 01:04:06.080 John Compton: All right, on to the mayor's report. I will try to… 483 01:04:06.170 --> 01:04:23.239 John Compton: condense, but I'm never very successful. The kudo is over the la- concerns everybody's pitching in. When I say everybody, it's residents, our contractor, RJ Landscapers, and even PEPCO. 484 01:04:23.400 --> 01:04:25.810 John Compton: For their efforts to, 485 01:04:26.070 --> 01:04:35.209 John Compton: Clear debris from the roads, and around, town, and, to restore power quickly, 486 01:04:35.420 --> 01:04:37.079 John Compton: Because of the wet snowfall. 487 01:04:38.570 --> 01:04:50.760 John Compton: All right, next item. I did want to make everybody aware, of some testimonies that I submitted, as mayor, it being, what is 488 01:04:51.070 --> 01:04:54.579 John Compton: Some circles is referred to as the silly season. 489 01:04:55.310 --> 01:05:05.319 John Compton: other circles, it's referred to as the legislative, process, on some bills. First of all, those in, 490 01:05:05.380 --> 01:05:17.580 John Compton: before the Maryland legislature, there was… there is this Starter and Silver Homes Act, which was, hearings were held in… in a Senate committee and a… 491 01:05:17.590 --> 01:05:27.719 John Compton: House Committee, Bob Bohr deserves tremendous credit for putting together a really, terrific 492 01:05:27.940 --> 01:05:32.990 John Compton: Letter, a series of, of discussion points. 493 01:05:33.030 --> 01:05:51.640 John Compton: In that letter as to, how that, proposal would impact Washington Grove, in particular, but by inference to many other municipalities. And that letter was submitted, 494 01:05:51.640 --> 01:06:09.749 John Compton: And, both I and, Georgette, as Planning Commission Chairs, signed on to that one. You can read it in the materials. Hb 950, House Bill, this was the County and Municipal Street Lighting Investment Act. Quite simply. 495 01:06:10.440 --> 01:06:29.980 John Compton: This bill, was supported and sponsored by a Montgomery County, legislator to, to resolve issues we're having with PEPCO, concerning the, the details of the process of, of, of. 496 01:06:30.260 --> 01:06:37.830 John Compton: Potentially buying the streetlights in our town, or any of the municipalities buying their streetlights. 497 01:06:37.930 --> 01:06:51.390 John Compton: and I'm not going to go into details, you can read this… read the letter. The legislation, is to have… asks that the state, 498 01:06:51.500 --> 01:07:11.049 John Compton: solve the issue we're having, rather than waiting for the Public Services Commission, of which there are several… also several actions brought by the municipalities, including Washington Grove, to resolve, the remaining difficulties that, just with PEPCO simply won't 499 01:07:11.170 --> 01:07:14.399 John Compton: Won't budge on. 500 01:07:14.980 --> 01:07:26.730 John Compton: Hb 1142, this, legislation, is a… was… was the pri… the single priority, really, of the, 501 01:07:26.990 --> 01:07:45.189 John Compton: of the Maryland Municipal League. It, points out what most municipal… all municipalities know, is that, revenue generation, is, very difficult when you have to, rely, 502 01:07:45.590 --> 01:07:58.910 John Compton: almost exclusively on real estate taxes. And consequently, you're stuck raising real estate taxes because you don't have many other options to raise revenue, and this 503 01:07:59.310 --> 01:08:11.550 John Compton: bill is relatively benign. It asks that the state set up a tax force to look into modernizing revenue structures for municipalities, and counties, for that matter. 504 01:08:11.870 --> 01:08:17.529 John Compton: It just, asks that the tax force be set up. We… my letter is in support. 505 01:08:18.040 --> 01:08:33.239 John Compton: Finally, in the county, I submitted a letter of support for funding the Shady Grove West Library, which is located in Shady Grove West, in the new housing that was built where the county service parks were a part of that 506 01:08:33.660 --> 01:08:47.559 John Compton: community were several public amenities, a school, a park, and a library, and this is the library, which is proposed to be in the capital improvement budget, so I just supported. 507 01:08:47.560 --> 01:08:49.859 Kathy Lehman: That the park, and the school. 508 01:08:49.960 --> 01:08:53.330 John Compton: Well, if there's going to be a school, which is questionable. 509 01:08:53.510 --> 01:08:56.919 John Compton: We'll be in the next phase of development. 510 01:08:57.040 --> 01:09:00.410 John Compton: Which is… creeping forward. 511 01:09:00.609 --> 01:09:06.240 John Compton: reality. And that's on the east side, perhaps. It's just the west side. 512 01:09:07.450 --> 01:09:20.539 John Compton: Okay, next item. The Washington Grove Connector Shared Use Pathway, not much to report. The 95% plans are in MCDOT's hands. They're going to be sharing that with the town's liaison group soon. 513 01:09:20.740 --> 01:09:28.939 John Compton: Importantly, in order to begin construction, we have to conclude an easement with MCDOT, and 514 01:09:29.109 --> 01:09:39.900 John Compton: Their… their approach to that, which we're kind of, you know, stuck with, is they're going to put one together and submit it to us for our 515 01:09:40.479 --> 01:09:41.450 John Compton: our… 516 01:09:41.640 --> 01:09:48.320 John Compton: use to decide what we… what, if anything, we want to change in that. So we're waiting for that. 517 01:09:50.390 --> 01:10:03.680 John Compton: Next item is, cracks in the hard tennis court. For tennis players who have, paid attention to the hard tennis court, there are a number of pretty long cracks. 518 01:10:03.720 --> 01:10:19.150 John Compton: some shorter, some longer, that have been present in past years, but are becoming more extensive. They always look worse in the winter, but they're definitely getting worse over time. 519 01:10:19.230 --> 01:10:27.120 John Compton: We've been looking into what it would take to repair the tennis court. We, when I say we, it's Linda and Meredith. 520 01:10:27.510 --> 01:10:33.879 John Compton: and, one, short, shorter term… so two approaches. 521 01:10:34.510 --> 01:10:38.680 John Compton: Three… there are three possibilities. One, you redo the whole tennis court. 522 01:10:39.610 --> 01:10:42.740 John Compton: That's in a $100,000 realm. 523 01:10:42.860 --> 01:10:59.910 John Compton: The other is you repair these cracks, professional, from the base up, which means you have to cut out a piece, all the way to the ground, and you build it up with the base, et cetera, et cetera, and you just repair where the crack is. 524 01:11:00.000 --> 01:11:04.300 John Compton: And lastly, the third approach is to fill the crack. 525 01:11:04.530 --> 01:11:19.179 John Compton: With something that will make the surface, smooth, but of course won't stand up, terribly well, to further weather-related or subsurface-related 526 01:11:19.300 --> 01:11:28.040 John Compton: issue. So we're gonna do a test on this crack repair proposal for the short-term approach. It's hugely cheaper, as you might imagine. 527 01:11:28.530 --> 01:11:30.980 John Compton: and see how that goes. 528 01:11:31.710 --> 01:11:33.520 John Compton: Alright, 529 01:11:34.270 --> 01:11:53.959 John Compton: The stormwater Infrastructure Management Project, nobody's seen anything happening. Well, it's going to happen pretty soon. We are in the final stages of adjusting the work plan. We now have the 100% engineering plans. 530 01:11:53.960 --> 01:11:55.890 John Compton: The last time we were… 531 01:11:56.050 --> 01:12:06.870 John Compton: Reported it was only 65%, and there are… the 100% plans, have changed, the work a bit, and as well as 532 01:12:07.170 --> 01:12:22.789 John Compton: would increase the cost, and we are… which is not unexpected, but we're reviewing those to make sure that, you know, they all fit the parameters of the project. So more on that when we have, 533 01:12:22.810 --> 01:12:29.219 John Compton: a bottom line. But the work will, in any event, will start sometime this spring. 534 01:12:29.320 --> 01:12:30.960 John Compton: Sooner the better, of course. 535 01:12:31.660 --> 01:12:36.130 Peter Nagrod: So, are they not… are they talking about cutting out certain, 536 01:12:36.630 --> 01:12:44.570 John Compton: No, no, no, no. All our work areas remain, pretty much intact. It's just a matter of 537 01:12:44.900 --> 01:12:49.440 John Compton: you know, certain aspects of what we're doing in some of the areas. Right. 538 01:12:49.920 --> 01:12:50.510 Peter Nagrod: Good. 539 01:12:50.870 --> 01:12:53.149 John Compton: How many culverts under… 540 01:12:54.000 --> 01:13:05.879 John Compton: this and that, for example. So, okay. Last item I put on here was the playground committee has announced a playground spring cleaning event, first 541 01:13:06.250 --> 01:13:07.950 John Compton: Annual, I suspect? 542 01:13:08.170 --> 01:13:27.400 John Compton: To take place on Saturday, March 21st. Volunteers are, sought, of course, and, the activities are gonna… they're gonna… they plan to put some engineered wood chips on some of the area floor, floors, do some staining and some other… 543 01:13:27.580 --> 01:13:32.670 John Compton: You know, volunteer, short-term cleaning and maintenance jobs. 544 01:13:34.680 --> 01:13:40.050 John Compton: All right, before I close out, my remarks, I do want to just. 545 01:13:40.050 --> 01:13:41.590 Kathy Lehman: Mention, as most. 546 01:13:41.590 --> 01:13:48.010 John Compton: Most of you know Betty Knight passed away, that's Kathy's… mother, 547 01:13:48.220 --> 01:13:57.250 John Compton: She's been, you know, a stalwart resident of the town for 60 years. 548 01:13:58.220 --> 01:14:15.160 John Compton: So we've got the McCatherines, we've got the Horans, we've got lots of… we do have a lot of long-term residents, the waiters, of course. But, but Betty and I lived here, with her kids and her husband for a long time. 549 01:14:15.610 --> 01:14:17.430 Kathy Lehman: Since 1966. 550 01:14:17.580 --> 01:14:18.100 John Compton: Yep. 551 01:14:19.530 --> 01:14:33.260 John Compton: So, we all know, Betty was a school teacher, which I guess came after she was involved in her first husband's veterinary business? 552 01:14:33.390 --> 01:14:33.880 Kathy Lehman: Right. 553 01:14:35.210 --> 01:14:44.579 John Compton: And, you know, is, was… was… Had a service, and… Or otherwise, so… 554 01:14:44.800 --> 01:14:48.619 John Compton: Sympathies to Kathy and her sister. 555 01:14:48.920 --> 01:14:52.000 John Compton: And. 556 01:14:52.250 --> 01:14:53.060 Kathy Lehman: Nancy. 557 01:14:53.770 --> 01:14:54.480 John Compton: Yeah. 558 01:14:56.600 --> 01:15:04.929 John Compton: So, sadly… Can I… can I take a minute to thank everybody that was there? It was… the turnout was incredible, over 1980 people. 559 01:15:05.560 --> 01:15:07.760 John Compton: And I wanted to thank you all for coming. 560 01:15:10.340 --> 01:15:11.060 John Compton: Okay. 561 01:15:13.550 --> 01:15:16.490 John Compton: Alrighty, that's the end of my, 562 01:15:16.680 --> 01:15:21.910 John Compton: Remarks, any questions, or anything else we want to, hit… 563 01:15:22.630 --> 01:15:36.519 John Compton: Okay, if not, next item, is the town archiving project. Peter had requested, and it was very timely, because we are… have a particular reason to, 564 01:15:37.170 --> 01:15:54.790 John Compton: revisit the town archiving project, and I asked Bob to, Bob Bohr, the HPC chair, to, summarize some aspects of that project for the Council. So, that's where we are, and Bob, do you have anything you want to show or not? I didn't… 565 01:15:55.150 --> 01:16:01.800 Robert Booher: No, can I ask whether you did… were able to post, the material that I… that I, sent you? 566 01:16:01.800 --> 01:16:10.999 John Compton: Didn't I? If I didn't, I should have. It will be in that folder. I thought I put it in, but there's every chance I overlooked it. 567 01:16:11.770 --> 01:16:16.160 Robert Booher: To the council members, did they see the, the report, is essentially what… 568 01:16:16.210 --> 01:16:17.070 John Compton: Now. 569 01:16:17.070 --> 01:16:17.920 Robert Booher: question is. 570 01:16:18.370 --> 01:16:19.890 John Compton: No, apparently not. 571 01:16:20.080 --> 01:16:21.940 John Compton: Oh. Town Archives Project. 572 01:16:23.560 --> 01:16:31.490 John Compton: I always forget something, it's… Okay, it's there now, so… you weren't going to be able to go through it anyway. 573 01:16:31.950 --> 01:16:37.870 John Compton: but… but maybe you can just give us the highlights. 574 01:16:37.870 --> 01:16:48.070 Robert Booher: Okay, I'll try to summarize. There's a written sort of description of where it appears we are. 575 01:16:48.070 --> 01:16:58.300 Robert Booher: At the moment, there needs to be more assessment that's… to be done of the condition of it, and it's a little bit difficult right now, of course, because it's all in the… 576 01:16:58.410 --> 01:17:07.280 Robert Booher: storage containers. So, once that… once that, stuff goes back, we can get a little bit… a bit of a better assessment of it. 577 01:17:07.510 --> 01:17:18.370 Robert Booher: But, the long and short of it is that our longtime archivist, Pat Petula, seems to have disappeared. So. 578 01:17:18.370 --> 01:17:22.670 Peter Nagrod: She, she, over the past year, she was doing less and less work. 579 01:17:22.700 --> 01:17:31.200 Robert Booher: And, she ran into some medical difficulties, and, we… I have tried to… the last I heard from her was in December. 580 01:17:31.350 --> 01:17:34.329 Robert Booher: And I think Kathy also heard from her, 581 01:17:34.440 --> 01:17:46.500 Robert Booher: sort of a call out of the blue. She was, in a rehab, facility, but I haven't heard from her, nor have I… has she responded to any of my, 582 01:17:46.930 --> 01:17:48.150 Robert Booher: messages. 583 01:17:48.480 --> 01:17:53.510 Robert Booher: We could go knock on her door, if we… Huh. 584 01:17:53.910 --> 01:17:59.930 Robert Booher: I think we need to do that. But I think that, all in all, I think that we probably have, 585 01:18:00.090 --> 01:18:16.210 Robert Booher: gotten to the end of our relationship with Pat, pretty much. It would be nice if we could contact her to help with the transition to another archivist, but we can't really assume that we did that. 586 01:18:16.260 --> 01:18:32.759 Robert Booher: we can do that. So, just as a summary, Pat was, I believe Pat was hired in 2014 to work on the camp meeting material, which we had accumulated in the archive room. 587 01:18:32.920 --> 01:18:43.410 Robert Booher: And the archive room was specially built for that purpose, is to house all of the town records that had been in people's basements up to that point. 588 01:18:43.710 --> 01:18:56.710 Robert Booher: So it was, was organized onto several shelves and into file cabinets. I think Steve did a, did a good part of that. 589 01:18:56.740 --> 01:19:05.159 Robert Booher: And Pat then assigned a numbering system to all of the material, both that material that's in the archive room, but also in the 590 01:19:05.170 --> 01:19:18.069 Robert Booher: in the council chambers, there's two plan files, there's a couple bookcases. So she assigned a numbering system to all of these items in order to start getting 591 01:19:18.240 --> 01:19:19.359 Robert Booher: A hand wash. 592 01:19:19.820 --> 01:19:24.409 Robert Booher: And then she started cataloging, which means, going through all, 593 01:19:24.930 --> 01:19:36.290 Robert Booher: box by box, through the various material, and providing a description and a catalog number for each of the items. 594 01:19:37.120 --> 01:19:52.299 Robert Booher: In 2017, the town adopted a records management plan, which was actually mandated by the state, and that went through some negotiation back and forth. Maryland 595 01:19:52.300 --> 01:20:04.000 Robert Booher: Frye was, championing this, and is the records management officer. And, the Council approved the plan, which, describes exactly what, 596 01:20:04.030 --> 01:20:16.630 Robert Booher: Needs to have… needs to be saved and archived at the state level, for, to meet the… to meet the… both our ordinance and state requirements. 597 01:20:16.730 --> 01:20:25.850 Robert Booher: So there's a difference. What Pat had been working on, the camp meeting material, is the old stuff, prior to the town 598 01:20:25.850 --> 01:20:37.220 Robert Booher: becoming a municipality in 1937. So there's… there's a substantial amount of records that the… was from the Camp Meeting Association, and… and other… 599 01:20:37.320 --> 01:20:52.280 Robert Booher: other activities. And that is old and historic stuff, but is not actually part of the official town records as a municipality, and the state is not 600 01:20:53.780 --> 01:21:11.949 Robert Booher: mandating keeping of that. But since it is historic, we essentially, convinced, talked to State Archives into accepting it as what's called a special collection. So, that has been receiving boxes of material that Pat has cataloged. 601 01:21:12.020 --> 01:21:30.139 Robert Booher: And, and there is… there is more that is, we believe, that is ready to go to the state and needs to be, finalized. So Pat had pretty much, focused on the camp meeting stuff. She… she really did not, 602 01:21:30.140 --> 01:21:33.899 Robert Booher: Get her, her, fingers into 603 01:21:34.020 --> 01:21:46.140 Robert Booher: the actual municipal records, the town records. So that has yet to happen. And as part of what I submitted, there is a copy of the 604 01:21:46.310 --> 01:22:04.389 Robert Booher: Of the records management plan, and of the records that are in the plan are things like any audits or budgets, financial reports, general correspondence, from official correspondence. 605 01:22:04.510 --> 01:22:07.960 Robert Booher: Legislation, master plans. 606 01:22:08.200 --> 01:22:26.360 Robert Booher: administrative files regarding suits or agreements or easements or deeds, town council minutes, legal opinions, annual meeting minutes, policies, and any relevant correspondence, the election results. 607 01:22:26.360 --> 01:22:33.779 Robert Booher: the Planning Commission work, both minutes and, and, surveys, subdivisions, stuff like that. 608 01:22:33.910 --> 01:22:46.499 Robert Booher: The, and the HPC, because it's a commission as well, minutes, reports, and guidelines, rules of procedure, and then, the special collection. So that's mentioned in the, in the, 609 01:22:46.720 --> 01:22:48.150 Robert Booher: records management. 610 01:22:48.650 --> 01:22:49.620 Robert Booher: plan. 611 01:22:49.620 --> 01:23:13.039 Robert Booher: So those… those are the things that the state mandates that we provide records of to them so that they can hang on to it. And the reason behind that is if… apparently they've probably run into many situations where a municipality gets sued for one reason or other, and nobody can find the records to actually 612 01:23:13.080 --> 01:23:24.950 Robert Booher: proceed with a suit, so it causes a great deal of consternation. So they have passed this loss saying that we need… we need copies of all of this stuff just… just in case. 613 01:23:25.460 --> 01:23:34.580 Robert Booher: So, so there's that, that, part of it. And, in the, in the process of, 614 01:23:34.780 --> 01:23:47.640 Robert Booher: Pat's going through this, we… we got a program, an archiving program called Past Perfect, which is the standard program that, that all 615 01:23:47.870 --> 01:23:50.490 Robert Booher: That most archiving, 616 01:23:51.800 --> 01:24:11.230 Robert Booher: entities use, both municipalities and museums and collections, etc. It's sort of the main program. And she got conversant with the program and assigned a numbering system for all of the items and entered it into the database of the Past Perfect program. 617 01:24:11.630 --> 01:24:17.550 Robert Booher: Let's see… 618 01:24:17.930 --> 01:24:32.559 Robert Booher: Yeah, and we actually worked without a contract with Pat for a while. She was a con… just a contract… had a con… had an informal contract, and we formalized the contract in 2018. 619 01:24:32.600 --> 01:24:42.620 Robert Booher: And I also included her contract as an attachment to what you will now be seeing. 620 01:24:42.780 --> 01:24:51.279 Robert Booher: But Pat, like I said, never was able to get past, complete the camp meeting, 621 01:24:51.440 --> 01:25:00.140 Robert Booher: material. There's a binder that, sits by the computer in the… in the office there, called the, 622 01:25:00.220 --> 01:25:04.329 Robert Booher: the archive locator binder, and it has 623 01:25:04.390 --> 01:25:13.829 Robert Booher: pages, and I've also included some of this so that you can see in what I submitted, so you can see the extent of what we're talking about. 624 01:25:13.880 --> 01:25:27.510 Robert Booher: In there, there's 126 boxes that are… that are listed. Then there are drawers in the plan files, and the file cabinets, and and the shelving. So she's pretty much… 625 01:25:28.340 --> 01:25:45.700 Robert Booher: scoped out, you know, all of… all of the… all of the stuff we have, and she has been diving into the minutiae within each box, and… and starting with the Camp Meeting Association, and and moving on. 626 01:25:47.980 --> 01:25:54.320 Robert Booher: So, what… regarding the, the mandated stuff. 627 01:25:54.640 --> 01:26:01.999 Robert Booher: the municipal records, of course, starting in 1937 up until somewhere in the 90s. 628 01:26:02.130 --> 01:26:09.190 Robert Booher: It's all on paper. So, there's… there's minutes of… of meetings, etc, all of the things that I mentioned. 629 01:26:09.330 --> 01:26:27.590 Robert Booher: Starting in the 90s, I think, things started to be digitized, and so there's a… there's a combination of digital and, and, and, paper, and now it's pretty much all digitized. So, we've gotten to the point where the records, any records transfer… 630 01:26:27.590 --> 01:26:35.370 Robert Booher: Records transfer is much easier, because you can just make a thumb drive and send it on to them. 631 01:26:35.540 --> 01:26:48.299 Robert Booher: But between 1937 and the present day, there are a lot of paper records that also need to be cataloged, entered into the Past Perfect program. 632 01:26:48.620 --> 01:26:53.270 Robert Booher: and, scanned, and then put, and sent to the, to the State Archive. 633 01:26:54.950 --> 01:27:07.359 Robert Booher: So, of the, of the camp meeting, material, I don't have a complete handle myself on, on, on the quantity of it. 634 01:27:07.360 --> 01:27:23.709 Robert Booher: Marilyn, worked with Pat initially, and they purchased 30 clamshell boxes, which were sort of the gray boxes that kind of do this, which were the… they're archival boxes, and that's how they… the stuff gets sent to the… to the state. 635 01:27:23.720 --> 01:27:27.709 Robert Booher: And so her recollection was there were about. 636 01:27:27.760 --> 01:27:44.260 Robert Booher: 30 of those boxes that, had been identified as camp meeting records to go to the state. We have records of about 15 or 16 of those going… going to the… to the… to the state in two different transfers. 637 01:27:44.260 --> 01:27:49.960 Robert Booher: in conversations with Pat, Marilyn indicated that she thought that 638 01:27:49.960 --> 01:28:03.760 Robert Booher: that perhaps 20 had gone to the state, and there were 10 more to happen. We don't know what that is. I've been going through the locator binder to try to get an understanding of what has been done and what hasn't been done. 639 01:28:03.840 --> 01:28:11.189 Robert Booher: And I have a better understanding of that, but we really won't know until we actually get the boxes back out of the 640 01:28:11.390 --> 01:28:20.759 Robert Booher: the storage unit and, back in the hall, and then, essentially back on the shelves. And then we can make that assessment as to what… where we are on that. 641 01:28:23.330 --> 01:28:36.589 Robert Booher: So, another portion of this is that Marilyn is suggesting that we migrate the past perfect from the computer that's in the town office. 642 01:28:36.750 --> 01:28:54.300 Robert Booher: dedicated to this, migrate it to the cloud, essentially, to Pass Perfect Online. It will be more accessible to everybody, if that's the case. Won't require somebody to sit with… if somebody wants to do research, whether it be a resident. 643 01:28:54.300 --> 01:28:56.820 Robert Booher: Or, a scholar. 644 01:28:56.820 --> 01:28:57.180 Peter Nagrod: So… 645 01:28:57.180 --> 01:29:10.680 Robert Booher: of some sort, they can go directly into that information in the cloud, rather than having to sit with the archivist and pull it up on a computer. So that seems like it's a good idea. 646 01:29:11.130 --> 01:29:16.789 Robert Booher: And, and we, in, we have, actually… 647 01:29:18.610 --> 01:29:30.290 Robert Booher: Fortunately, we have somebody that is interested in helping us out with this, and it's Margaret Church's daughter, Joanna. And I also provided a resume that 648 01:29:30.300 --> 01:29:42.360 Robert Booher: of Joanna, from Joanna, in the material that I submitted. She seems to… she is, conversant in the Past Perfect program. She is conversant in, in, 649 01:29:42.860 --> 01:29:47.189 Robert Booher: Also, in… as a museum curator… curator. 650 01:29:47.430 --> 01:29:51.370 Robert Booher: And, in general archiving and records management. 651 01:29:51.920 --> 01:29:54.290 Robert Booher: I think it… it… she… 652 01:29:54.720 --> 01:30:05.310 Robert Booher: it seems like highly qualified, well qualified to help us out with this. Whether she's interested in helping us out as much as we need help. 653 01:30:05.370 --> 01:30:16.520 Robert Booher: I'm not sure. She is currently employed, so at least at the outset, if we engage her to help us with this, it would be on a part-time basis. 654 01:30:18.470 --> 01:30:20.610 Robert Booher: So… 655 01:30:20.720 --> 01:30:27.369 Robert Booher: The things that need to be done is we need to make… make… we need to get the boxes back in. 656 01:30:27.480 --> 01:30:44.190 Robert Booher: And, into… back into the… into the hall, and we need to make an assessment of where we… where we are exactly on the whole camp meeting process that Pat was doing. We have to see how far she got on the work that she had pretty much identified for herself. 657 01:30:44.190 --> 01:30:51.499 Robert Booher: And so that will involve verifying both 658 01:30:51.780 --> 01:30:54.320 Robert Booher: The boxes that have gone to the state. 659 01:30:54.530 --> 01:30:58.850 Robert Booher: Verifying the boxes that were… she claimed were ready to go to the state. 660 01:30:59.320 --> 01:31:05.289 Robert Booher: that they have been entered into the Past Perfect program, and indeed are then ready to transmit to the state. 661 01:31:05.390 --> 01:31:14.630 Robert Booher: Then make an assessment of any remaining boxes that we have that are part of what we would call the camp meeting records. 662 01:31:15.460 --> 01:31:23.740 Robert Booher: And once we get a handle on that, we can kind of understand how much time that might take to go through. 663 01:31:23.940 --> 01:31:30.029 Robert Booher: It would probably be a good idea for her to look at what we, what we have. 664 01:31:30.200 --> 01:31:34.559 Robert Booher: As a link from the website to something called the, 665 01:31:35.560 --> 01:31:48.480 Robert Booher: the online museum, and in that, there's, about 300, entries, objects that, Pat has entered, both, documents and photographs and, 666 01:31:49.180 --> 01:31:52.160 Robert Booher: And, records of the books, and the, and the, 667 01:31:53.560 --> 01:32:07.060 Robert Booher: a couple objects. But, that would be good for her to take a look at that to see… make an assessment of what is it do we want to put on that particular, link from our website. 668 01:32:07.720 --> 01:32:14.500 Robert Booher: And then… Then we need to really get our teeth into the records management. 669 01:32:14.650 --> 01:32:21.910 Robert Booher: And we may, once we make the assessment of how far away we are from completing the camp meeting. 670 01:32:21.910 --> 01:32:41.439 Robert Booher: We may, want to focus, and I think this is Maryland's opinion, we want to focus on what is mandated by the state in terms of our municipal records, which has not been started at all. So, that's a different project. Again, it's the boxes of records from 1937 on. 671 01:32:41.540 --> 01:32:55.270 Robert Booher: And then the digital records as well. And it would be a matter of looking at the list of what's in the plan, and making a priority of what to tackle first. 672 01:32:59.430 --> 01:33:13.369 Robert Booher: And then… then beyond that, beyond the municipal records and the camp meeting, there's boxes of other stuff, which, who knows what it is exactly. I mean, Pat did make lists of a lot of the stuff. 673 01:33:13.520 --> 01:33:25.299 Robert Booher: But there's, there's, boxes that, residents have left in the, in the office. There have, there are, boxes that, that sort of 674 01:33:25.300 --> 01:33:37.020 Robert Booher: our records from the various battles that we have waged. There are, music. There's a whole file cabinet full of music, sheet music. 675 01:33:37.190 --> 01:33:45.250 Robert Booher: There's a whole bunch of stuff that, somebody needs to decide whether we want to keep it and, and how we want to keep it. 676 01:33:45.960 --> 01:33:47.000 Robert Booher: So… 677 01:33:47.320 --> 01:34:00.759 Robert Booher: My thought was… was, I think, I'm pretty interested in trying to get Joanna to help us with this, and to have her do, sort of, the assessment of how 678 01:34:01.120 --> 01:34:01.960 Robert Booher: Far. 679 01:34:02.120 --> 01:34:05.219 Robert Booher: Pat got, in the, in the process. 680 01:34:05.670 --> 01:34:16.650 Robert Booher: And, and see how she… how she settles into the project, and then perhaps, we can get her advice on, what to do with the next step. 681 01:34:17.990 --> 01:34:19.939 Robert Booher: So that's sort of where we are. 682 01:34:21.930 --> 01:34:22.929 Robert Booher: At the moment. 683 01:34:24.600 --> 01:34:30.409 John Compton: All right, thank you, Bob. Any questions from the Council for Bob while he's here? 684 01:34:31.030 --> 01:34:43.060 John Compton: So, in practical terms, obviously, project started in 2000 and… team, has moved 685 01:34:43.550 --> 01:34:48.419 John Compton: Maybe the needle has moved a bit, but, there's an awful lot. 686 01:34:48.530 --> 01:34:54.389 John Compton: remaining, I am not… Familiar with this records management 687 01:34:55.290 --> 01:35:02.709 John Compton: resolution, or what, if anything, was, the scope of… well, I have Pat's 688 01:35:02.970 --> 01:35:07.540 John Compton: We do have Pat's work, agreement. 689 01:35:07.900 --> 01:35:11.170 John Compton: A contractor, so it does list what she's supposed to be doing. 690 01:35:11.360 --> 01:35:13.030 John Compton: But… 691 01:35:13.030 --> 01:35:16.309 Robert Booher: That doesn't… that doesn't detail the records management plan. 692 01:35:16.310 --> 01:35:22.779 John Compton: No, no, there's a recommend… records management plan is… is definitely something we have official 693 01:35:23.130 --> 01:35:25.840 John Compton: We have officially adopted them. 694 01:35:27.210 --> 01:35:33.480 John Compton: So, we can revisit all that. In practical time, Marilyn, just a moment, I'll let you chime in in a sec. 695 01:35:33.650 --> 01:35:43.140 John Compton: You know, going forward, we're in budget season, so clearly, clearly there's a clear need 696 01:35:43.250 --> 01:35:46.110 John Compton: For, a professional. 697 01:35:46.240 --> 01:35:50.010 John Compton: to… re… jumpstart. 698 01:35:50.140 --> 01:35:54.500 John Compton: The whole project, if it's going to go forward at all. 699 01:35:54.650 --> 01:35:58.510 John Compton: And I think that was Bob's bottom line of his recommendation. 700 01:35:58.670 --> 01:36:04.980 John Compton: After he… after he, overwhelmed everyone with what needs to be done. 701 01:36:04.980 --> 01:36:05.490 Peter Nagrod: the… the… 702 01:36:07.650 --> 01:36:09.420 Robert Booher: You asked, Peter. 703 01:36:09.890 --> 01:36:12.790 Peter Nagrod: I… I did not ask that question. 704 01:36:13.060 --> 01:36:19.479 John Compton: All right, all right, I'll let Marilyn have the first, although, as records management. 705 01:36:19.700 --> 01:36:24.210 John Compton: Officer, so this is not a public statement, this is our records management officer. 706 01:36:24.210 --> 01:36:24.740 Peter Nagrod: Oh, okay. 707 01:36:24.890 --> 01:36:30.820 Marilynn Frey: I just want to give some background on it. It took us 2 years to put together the records management 708 01:36:31.020 --> 01:36:36.639 Marilynn Frey: Not only did we adopt it, but more importantly, the state adopted it. 709 01:36:36.750 --> 01:36:44.709 Marilynn Frey: That was the final step. We went through many iterations with them, they approved it each step of the way, and then they signed off on the final one. 710 01:36:46.640 --> 01:36:53.719 Marilynn Frey: It's 4 or 5 pages long, it goes into a great deal of detail, and the camp meeting is, like, one paragraph on the last page. 711 01:36:54.100 --> 01:36:57.030 Marilynn Frey: So that's… Gives you some idea of the scope. 712 01:36:58.010 --> 01:37:02.710 Marilynn Frey: And, you know, as far as the program itself, This is the… 713 01:37:03.250 --> 01:37:07.150 Marilynn Frey: instruction manual for the program. It's not something that we can just 714 01:37:07.700 --> 01:37:10.369 Marilynn Frey: Pick somebody off the street and have them learn it. 715 01:37:10.600 --> 01:37:12.760 Marilynn Frey: I'm pushing very hard to have it tr… 716 01:37:13.280 --> 01:37:23.769 Marilynn Frey: migrated to one that's online so that, like, if Margaret's daughter wanted to work from home, she could easily do it, or be in the town hall. Houston, we have a problem. 717 01:37:24.810 --> 01:37:31.210 Marilynn Frey: But, I just, I wanted to give some background as to how the, the… Oh. 718 01:37:32.340 --> 01:37:38.180 Marilynn Frey: plan was developed and approved, and it did. It took us 2 years of work to get that done. 719 01:37:40.180 --> 01:37:45.560 John Compton: So, yes, that's now in the materials. I apologize for not having put it in. 720 01:37:45.770 --> 01:37:57.110 John Compton: Previously, it's in there. You'll find the, the state plan from 2016, and the other, documents that Bob provided, including his 721 01:37:57.290 --> 01:38:03.309 John Compton: A report, his written report, covering, most of what he said. 722 01:38:03.310 --> 01:38:13.079 Robert Booher: Yeah, there's also the entire index out of the locator, so that'll give you an idea of the scope of the number of boxes that there are. 723 01:38:13.370 --> 01:38:27.179 Robert Booher: And, as well, I gave an example of, of a cataloging sheet of one of the boxes, and then also, a, 724 01:38:27.440 --> 01:38:37.370 Robert Booher: a printout from the Past Perfect program to… on one of the items, so that kind of gives you an idea of… will give you an idea of the scope. 725 01:38:38.310 --> 01:38:42.259 John Compton: So this archival locator document is on paper? 726 01:38:42.570 --> 01:38:43.770 John Compton: Yes. 727 01:38:44.000 --> 01:38:46.060 John Compton: That's great. That's wonderful. 728 01:38:47.250 --> 01:38:52.599 Robert Booher: Well, I mean, it's… it probably also is in the… 729 01:38:52.600 --> 01:38:54.020 John Compton: file, alright, okay. 730 01:38:54.820 --> 01:38:57.130 Robert Booher: as Word files, I, yeah. 731 01:38:58.200 --> 01:39:07.969 John Compton: Okay, so in practical terms, it impacts what we do with our budget, which will be, discussed, in two weeks. Any other, anybody else in the Council? 732 01:39:07.970 --> 01:39:12.609 Peter Nagrod: Yeah, I have a, I have a comment. So, so this highlights… 733 01:39:12.690 --> 01:39:24.010 Peter Nagrod: This is just one… one of the issues we have with knowledge management in this town, and this comes up. We're a town of volunteers, and we have turnovers. 734 01:39:24.040 --> 01:39:33.279 Peter Nagrod: And, you know, we've been fortunate to have a Charlie Charlestron and a Kathy, and a few other people who have so much in their heads 735 01:39:33.370 --> 01:39:37.140 Peter Nagrod: And Charlie tried to transfer that in his document, which was… 736 01:39:37.220 --> 01:39:51.609 Peter Nagrod: You know, it's hard to find things, and so I think that, you know, we're… we need to go into a new era here with technology. I think as we talked about, like, the new clerk that's coming in, or the manager, whoever this person's gonna be. 737 01:39:51.610 --> 01:39:57.440 Peter Nagrod: I think the town really does need to put a really, big emphasis on knowledge management. 738 01:39:57.480 --> 01:39:58.709 Peter Nagrod: You know. 739 01:39:59.040 --> 01:40:11.660 Peter Nagrod: cap… cap… capturing, what we need, like, like, planning commission, you know, we go through this all the time, trying to find ordinances, you know, it's… it's a project that goes on and on, and, 740 01:40:11.870 --> 01:40:19.899 Peter Nagrod: you know, this… we need to just, you know, put a little bit more focus. Even, like, with what Eva said, it affects that. You know, we don't know what we don't know. 741 01:40:20.070 --> 01:40:36.849 Peter Nagrod: And… and this is… this is something which, you know, it's nobody's fault, you know, this town's been around forever, but I think that, in our discussions with the new clerk and what they were talking about, that whole process, I think we're going in a different direction. I think it'll be really helpful for us. 742 01:40:37.080 --> 01:40:49.800 Robert Booher: Yeah, and the archiving, once we get it to sort of happen automatically, i.e. every year, then we won't end up with all these boxes and boxes of stuff. 743 01:40:51.060 --> 01:40:56.540 Peter Nagrod: So I just had one other question. So we sent all this stuff to the archives, to Maryland, to the, state. 744 01:40:56.770 --> 01:41:01.189 Peter Nagrod: Is there a way to act… can we access what they have? 745 01:41:02.250 --> 01:41:03.350 Peter Nagrod: Is that all… is that… 746 01:41:03.350 --> 01:41:04.859 Robert Booher: Caroline can answer that. 747 01:41:05.290 --> 01:41:05.900 Peter Nagrod: Oh. 748 01:41:06.300 --> 01:41:08.180 Marilynn Frey: Hi. Yeah, 749 01:41:08.350 --> 01:41:22.159 Marilynn Frey: So far, the only thing that has been sent is from the camp meeting, and that's in what they call a special collection. And we can ask for any of that back. I believe for the 150th anniversary, Pat had a few things brought back and then sent back. 750 01:41:22.490 --> 01:41:24.599 Marilynn Frey: We wanted it in this… in… 751 01:41:24.740 --> 01:41:41.590 Marilynn Frey: the archives in Baltimore for safekeeping. I mean, it's a wood-framed building. If it burned down, we would have lost all of our history. That was my… almost from the time I got involved, and I got involved because I had experience writing a records management program. 752 01:41:41.900 --> 01:41:47.480 Marilynn Frey: My big push has been, let's get this stuff someplace safe. 753 01:41:48.350 --> 01:41:52.960 Marilynn Frey: But, technically, it's not in the archives, it's in a special collection. 754 01:41:53.160 --> 01:41:55.929 Peter Nagrod: So it's just a storage, so it's just being stored for us. 755 01:41:55.930 --> 01:42:02.590 Marilynn Frey: Well, I mean, everything is recorded, they have an absolute record of where everything is, what's there in the special collection. 756 01:42:03.010 --> 01:42:04.600 Marilynn Frey: Not in the archive part. 757 01:42:05.240 --> 01:42:05.880 Peter Nagrod: Okay. 758 01:42:06.240 --> 01:42:08.930 Robert Booher: It's, it's, Peter, it's next to the Ark of the Covenant. 759 01:42:09.710 --> 01:42:11.370 Peter Nagrod: I was thinking of that. 760 01:42:12.090 --> 01:42:14.279 John Compton: You know that big room? Yeah. 761 01:42:16.990 --> 01:42:20.210 Peter Nagrod: Good ending, thank you. 762 01:42:20.210 --> 01:42:21.040 John Compton: Alright. 763 01:42:21.270 --> 01:42:22.639 John Compton: Anybody else? 764 01:42:23.450 --> 01:42:26.090 John Compton: Okay, thanks, Bob. 765 01:42:26.720 --> 01:42:30.369 John Compton: All right, we'll move on to the administrative matters, which… 766 01:42:30.850 --> 01:42:39.990 John Compton: is rather extensive. So, we're gonna start with the, permit for operation of Summer in the Parks, just by way of, 767 01:42:40.600 --> 01:42:54.780 John Compton: Well, I'll… I'll let Eva introduce this, but just… just before I say that, the number of people asked the question, this year, 768 01:42:54.780 --> 01:42:56.070 Kathy Lehman: Recently. 769 01:42:56.070 --> 01:43:06.319 John Compton: As to whether or not the camp was following prescribed prescribed procedures and requirements for a summer camp. 770 01:43:06.560 --> 01:43:11.159 John Compton: So, we've looked into that, we being, 771 01:43:11.490 --> 01:43:16.549 John Compton: Ava, Laurel, and John, and myself. 772 01:43:16.780 --> 01:43:25.539 John Compton: And, our conclusion from examining state law, and without asking for any legal advice. 773 01:43:25.780 --> 01:43:31.560 John Compton: Is that we, in spite of the anecdotal 774 01:43:32.750 --> 01:43:40.700 John Compton: Information, provided from others, over the years that we are exempt, that in fact, we're not exempt. 775 01:43:40.980 --> 01:43:44.229 John Compton: Program is simply not exempt from requirements. 776 01:43:45.140 --> 01:43:52.699 John Compton: So, with that conclusion, the question was, do we continue to do Summer in the Parks? 777 01:43:53.110 --> 01:44:03.620 John Compton: and… and get the permit and, meet the requirements? Or do we… Point. 778 01:44:04.230 --> 01:44:21.500 John Compton: Well, since Summer in the Parks is already off and running this year, the decision was, substantially with the, with the willingness of, Eva and Lowell to, 779 01:44:22.090 --> 01:44:31.819 John Compton: to pursue meeting the requirements, which is a permit and a bunch of other stuff, and Eve is going to comment on all of that now. That is the background. 780 01:44:32.010 --> 01:44:34.549 John Compton: So Ava, if you… 781 01:44:34.550 --> 01:44:53.019 Eva: Yeah, I'll… you know, I put all of this in writing, so I will try not to take up too much time. You can read all the things that I sent to Council. But yeah, basically, you know, I… we already have 30 campers registered, parents are, you know. 782 01:44:53.310 --> 01:45:07.559 Eva: they need this, so I don't think it would make sense to not do Summer in the Parks. It's certainly something we can talk about for next year, but by that time, all of this work will have been done, hopefully, so it won't be as big of an issue. 783 01:45:07.650 --> 01:45:23.219 Eva: I did talk to someone at the Maryland Department of Health the other day, expressing my, you know, anxiety. Could we get all of this done before camp opens in July? And she said she thought that we had plenty of time. Well, I don't know about plenty, but we had enough time 784 01:45:23.230 --> 01:45:41.900 Eva: to get everything accomplished that we need to do, we basically need to get licensed, through the state by the Maryland Department of Health, which is a whole process, and then we need to, get a certification from the county, for recreational. 785 01:45:42.080 --> 01:45:42.670 Kathy Lehman: Summer camp. 786 01:45:42.670 --> 01:45:43.280 Eva: camp. 787 01:45:44.600 --> 01:45:57.919 Eva: I've been looking into this. It's all… I mean, honestly, it's all stuff that we really need to be doing anyway. It's coming up with a written emergency, safety and health plan, training the staff. 788 01:45:57.920 --> 01:46:05.370 Eva: A big one is getting background checks for the staff and volunteers, which is something we haven't done before. It is gonna be… 789 01:46:05.370 --> 01:46:09.380 Eva: An annoying administrative burden on me, but… 790 01:46:09.380 --> 01:46:21.270 Eva: you know, were something to happen, and it came to light that I had not background checked the employees, you know, I think that would not be good. So, so that's gonna be a big change. 791 01:46:21.270 --> 01:46:31.950 Eva: But yeah, I'm working on it. I've watched several trainings now, about how to comply with the regulations to get us certified and licensed. 792 01:46:31.950 --> 01:46:37.569 Eva: I… and I'm happy to talk to people if you have specific questions about it. 793 01:46:37.570 --> 01:46:41.949 Eva: I'm trying to think if there's anything else important to say… 794 01:46:42.530 --> 01:46:58.340 Eva: But just, yeah, I'm working to get all of this accomplished by the time the camp starts. Hopefully, you know, maybe even… my goal is to get it done way before camp starts, maybe by the end of May, but, we do have until July 6th when the camp starts. 795 01:46:58.640 --> 01:47:00.070 Eva: And, 796 01:47:00.700 --> 01:47:17.510 Eva: Yeah, I don't… I mean, I don't want to go into too much detail. I do think it's really important that we do this. I think it will protect the town, it will protect the staff and volunteers and me, in case anything bad were to happen, and it's also just, I think, a lot of good practice. 797 01:47:17.660 --> 01:47:32.480 Eva: And probably, like I said, things we should have been doing anyway. I'm sure parents who have been signing their kids up for Summer in the Parks assumed that we were… or maybe they didn't, maybe that's why the question arose, but, you know, I just think that it… 798 01:47:32.730 --> 01:47:43.749 Eva: Even in the case that we were ever exempt, which it's not clear to me that we were, but I think this is something important that we need to be doing. So, if anybody has questions, let me know. 799 01:47:49.060 --> 01:47:49.610 John Compton: Fire. 800 01:47:50.330 --> 01:47:53.630 Kathy Lehman: I do want to comment, Ava has. 801 01:47:54.140 --> 01:48:06.980 John Compton: alluded to the requirements. So, as in, a lot of the stuff that the town believes we are… it's important to us. There's a… 802 01:48:07.620 --> 01:48:11.460 John Compton: A significant amount of volunteer time. 803 01:48:11.900 --> 01:48:25.240 John Compton: required to meet, and, and to produce the desired result. And this one, for sure, is, an unforeseen, commitment 804 01:48:25.360 --> 01:48:38.169 John Compton: She's absolutely right. Once you do it once, you'll have a lot of… virtually, you know, you'll have a procedure in place, you'll already have all the documents, here's what we do, but the first time's the worst. So, 805 01:48:38.450 --> 01:48:42.179 John Compton: We, we have to be, we have to, 806 01:48:42.440 --> 01:48:45.729 John Compton: be impressed that he was willing to take this on. 807 01:48:45.990 --> 01:48:51.140 John Compton: It having come out, you know, sort of just dropped into her lap. 808 01:48:52.760 --> 01:48:55.770 John Compton: Thank you, Eva. I owe everybody. 809 01:48:55.960 --> 01:49:00.340 John Compton: Here is going to appreciate it, and particularly the participants and 810 01:49:00.520 --> 01:49:02.710 John Compton: In the, in the program, I assume. 811 01:49:04.050 --> 01:49:06.170 John Compton: Okay, Council, questions? 812 01:49:06.550 --> 01:49:07.200 John Compton: I see… 813 01:49:07.610 --> 01:49:08.310 Eva: Yes. 814 01:49:08.310 --> 01:49:13.000 Barbara: Yeah, it's not really a question, it's just really, like, thank you, Eva, so much. 815 01:49:13.000 --> 01:49:13.610 Peter Nagrod: much for. 816 01:49:13.610 --> 01:49:38.520 Barbara: recognizing this and being so diligent about it. I mean, when you were faced with it, you could have just said, oh my gosh, like, I can't deal with this, this is too much, this is not what I signed up for, and you're really going a long way to put us in compliance. And you're right, it's really important that we do this, and I just really want to thank you so much for recognizing that, and for the other people who are working 817 01:49:38.520 --> 01:49:39.510 Barbara: with you. 818 01:49:39.510 --> 01:49:42.520 Barbara: to make this happen, because it's really important. Thank you. 819 01:49:43.140 --> 01:49:44.080 Eva: Appreciate that. 820 01:49:49.450 --> 01:49:50.540 John Compton: Anybody else? 821 01:49:51.410 --> 01:49:54.670 John Compton: Let's see, I forgot what I put on there, 822 01:49:55.780 --> 01:50:02.300 John Compton: Yeah. Oh, okay, so, the, the… let me, let me, just state that, 823 01:50:03.070 --> 01:50:17.060 John Compton: Paul, in his personal, in his personal appearance, asked the question of what sort of liability do town volunteers incur in doing service for the town? 824 01:50:17.230 --> 01:50:27.649 John Compton: I, you know, the basic blanket, statement is… that… is… I… I don't know. 825 01:50:27.910 --> 01:50:33.679 John Compton: So what… how do we… how are we going to know? I'm gonna… I will consult with the town attorney. 826 01:50:33.830 --> 01:50:42.780 John Compton: I'll ask Jean Moyer, who has been being the front person with our insurance company, and, you know, they are legit. 827 01:50:42.990 --> 01:50:52.270 John Compton: It handles insurance for many municipalities, and you better believe this is a… A absolutely standard 828 01:50:52.460 --> 01:50:56.089 John Compton: Issue, so they should have a lot to say about this. 829 01:50:56.290 --> 01:51:05.370 John Compton: We may know the answer already, but I'm unwilling to give it, without reviewing and getting any further input. 830 01:51:05.550 --> 01:51:13.319 Eva: John, I'm just curious, did… I know we have, the insurer… insurer comes to do, you know, periodic 831 01:51:13.420 --> 01:51:18.320 Eva: check-ins. Were they ever aware that we ran a summer camp? 832 01:51:18.320 --> 01:51:20.750 John Compton: Well, that's a good question. So, yeah, they surveyed the. 833 01:51:21.600 --> 01:51:32.729 John Compton: Facilities, by which I mean the lake, you know, they walk around town, the hall, everything else. With respect to, our operational activities. 834 01:51:32.940 --> 01:51:39.910 John Compton: To tell you the truth, I don't immediately recall any statements concerning any of those. 835 01:51:41.110 --> 01:51:51.190 Jean Moyer: Yeah, John, I've not mentioned it to them. My understanding was that Mary Cholstrom had 836 01:51:51.860 --> 01:52:02.230 Jean Moyer: active interactions with them about what we do in town, but I… I have no basis to say whether she had specifically called that out or not. 837 01:52:03.280 --> 01:52:07.920 John Compton: Right, so we need to check with them. It would be pretty amazing that, 838 01:52:07.980 --> 01:52:21.080 John Compton: at some point, they weren't aware we were doing that program. We've had swimming lessons outside the Summer in the Parks at the lake, and other things like that, all of which the, you know, the 839 01:52:21.140 --> 01:52:29.740 John Compton: The second question out of everybody's mouths is, what's the town's liability? And they're the ones who we repeatedly ask. 840 01:52:29.900 --> 01:52:39.090 John Compton: And as you've probably heard many times, you know, the town has substantial liability coverage through Legit. 841 01:52:39.300 --> 01:52:47.130 John Compton: For all sorts of dropped balls and… you know, legal issues. 842 01:52:47.340 --> 01:52:49.709 John Compton: That might arise. 843 01:52:50.380 --> 01:52:55.430 John Compton: Okay, but that said, we can specifically address this and put together an answer. 844 01:52:55.970 --> 01:53:05.089 John Compton: We'll do better than put together an answer. We'll write something up with basically a status of our, 845 01:53:05.830 --> 01:53:07.289 John Compton: Liability exposure. 846 01:53:13.370 --> 01:53:16.549 John Compton: Alrighty, okay, so, moving… if we're… 847 01:53:16.970 --> 01:53:24.360 John Compton: To move on from that. I'd like Chris to just do a brief status report on the whole sprinkler system. 848 01:53:31.340 --> 01:53:38.180 Kriss Grisham: Here we go, had to unmute, sorry. So, the Hall sprinkler system, 849 01:53:39.860 --> 01:53:54.509 Kriss Grisham: We did, we're still waiting for the permit, bottom line. Our initial permit from a couple weeks ago was submitted and denied. They had us do what's called a flow test again. 850 01:53:54.660 --> 01:54:06.180 Kriss Grisham: And I just found out today that our numbers were a little bit off, so the design drawings had to be changed and resubmitted as of last Friday. 851 01:54:06.490 --> 01:54:14.689 Kriss Grisham: And we can't go forward until the fire permit is… Is approved. 852 01:54:15.530 --> 01:54:18.729 Kriss Grisham: So, we're kind of on hold, waiting. 853 01:54:19.040 --> 01:54:20.740 Kriss Grisham: The hall… 854 01:54:20.740 --> 01:54:22.070 John Compton: Are we? 855 01:54:22.520 --> 01:54:23.270 Kriss Grisham: Well… 856 01:54:23.400 --> 01:54:32.589 Kriss Grisham: The hall, the hall is, is, pretty much prepared, waiting, waiting for the, the new system. And, 857 01:54:32.970 --> 01:54:36.470 Kriss Grisham: they… I don't know if some of you have already noticed, but they did… 858 01:54:36.700 --> 01:54:41.209 Kriss Grisham: Take out the existing system, thinking that the permit was going to get approved last week. 859 01:54:41.530 --> 01:54:43.720 Kriss Grisham: And, it wasn't. 860 01:54:43.910 --> 01:54:49.110 Kriss Grisham: So with that said, you know, I need to emphasize. 861 01:54:49.210 --> 01:54:56.810 Kriss Grisham: we're… we're trying to… well, we are. We're restricting access to the hall, to, to three individuals, and that's, 862 01:54:56.930 --> 01:55:09.390 Kriss Grisham: Steve Wertz, Dane, Clark, and myself. So, if anybody needs to get into the hall, please reach out to one of us. You know, we're pretty much in construction mode. 863 01:55:09.950 --> 01:55:15.100 Kriss Grisham: So, yeah, we just can't have people going in and out of that building right now. 864 01:55:18.020 --> 01:55:18.920 John Compton: Okay. 865 01:55:19.210 --> 01:55:30.949 Kriss Grisham: And, you know, schedule-wise, they keep asking about the schedule. These guys, they seem to be pretty much on the ball. They said they were going to try to demo the system, like, in a day and a half. 866 01:55:30.950 --> 01:55:42.499 Kriss Grisham: And pretty much, they were able to do that. And then now they're, you know, one of the things that they said was being able to put it all back together in about a week, week and a half. So, we still have 867 01:55:43.350 --> 01:55:51.700 Kriss Grisham: We… I think we still have a good schedule, like, they're… they're projecting, Where is it? 868 01:55:51.850 --> 01:55:54.910 Kriss Grisham: March 20th, so we may slip about a week. 869 01:55:55.730 --> 01:56:01.950 Kriss Grisham: But, you know, once they get the system in, and then it's the restoration process to get the haul back together. 870 01:56:02.100 --> 01:56:04.520 Kriss Grisham: Steve has already purchased the… 871 01:56:04.640 --> 01:56:13.589 Kriss Grisham: The wood for the ceiling in the old council room, it came in today. And he said he was going to start working on staining that wood. 872 01:56:14.010 --> 01:56:20.559 Kriss Grisham: So, there's a lot of prep work that's going on right now as we speak, even though we're kind of dead in the water with, 873 01:56:20.930 --> 01:56:22.920 Kriss Grisham: Getting a new system installed. 874 01:56:24.850 --> 01:56:26.400 Kriss Grisham: Any questions? 875 01:56:27.660 --> 01:56:34.029 Peter Nagrod: Sorry, but I have to ask you this. What… if they… they took out the old system. 876 01:56:34.500 --> 01:56:37.809 Peter Nagrod: And they haven't put in a new system. What are they testing? 877 01:56:38.910 --> 01:56:45.909 Kriss Grisham: I'm sorry? Oh, if they took out the old system and didn't put in a new system yet, what's the test that they have to do? 878 01:56:46.690 --> 01:56:57.229 Kriss Grisham: No, the test is done, so when they pulled the… they pulled the old system out, and we had this thing called a flow test, which they… they had to… we had to get WSSC to come out. 879 01:56:57.230 --> 01:57:11.200 Kriss Grisham: And they connected to a hydrant down by the Circle, and another one over by Town Hall, and they opened up the system, and they tried to figure out what the water… how many gallons per minute we were getting. 880 01:57:11.200 --> 01:57:12.810 Peter Nagrod: Right. And the water pressure. 881 01:57:12.810 --> 01:57:21.670 Kriss Grisham: We gave them that data, And the reason the permit was denied, apparently, was because the system 882 01:57:22.170 --> 01:57:36.960 Kriss Grisham: It's 30-plus years old, and the reviewer wanted to get better data from… from what's called the riser. So, from within the pump facility, we had to do another flow test. 883 01:57:37.150 --> 01:57:39.779 Kriss Grisham: And Chesapeake Fire was able to do that. 884 01:57:39.940 --> 01:57:49.820 Kriss Grisham: And, what they found was You know, we're getting about… 10 pounds, A pressure less than expected. 885 01:57:50.260 --> 01:57:59.819 Kriss Grisham: And so the design had to be changed a little bit. I guess some of the pipes had to be increased in size, and now we're waiting for that second review. 886 01:58:00.230 --> 01:58:03.230 Peter Nagrod: Oh, okay, thanks. Okay, thank you. 887 01:58:04.210 --> 01:58:04.770 Kriss Grisham: So… 888 01:58:07.250 --> 01:58:09.889 John Compton: It would have been a miracle of the… 889 01:58:10.190 --> 01:58:14.330 John Compton: First magnitude for this permit to go through without… 890 01:58:14.750 --> 01:58:18.000 John Compton: questions. I, I fully expect additional 891 01:58:18.270 --> 01:58:21.649 John Compton: issues, but if we're lucky, they will simply 892 01:58:21.950 --> 01:58:25.440 John Compton: Write a list of things we need to do. 893 01:58:25.890 --> 01:58:31.219 John Compton: In order to pass an inspection that were not on the plans, and… 894 01:58:31.220 --> 01:58:31.660 Peter Nagrod: Hmm. 895 01:58:31.660 --> 01:58:37.709 John Compton: We can just, we can decide whether they make sense. Agree that they make sense, and go ahead and do it. 896 01:58:38.520 --> 01:58:42.060 John Compton: So that, if we're lucky, that's… that was what will happen next. 897 01:58:43.150 --> 01:58:56.330 Kriss Grisham: Yeah, one of the things also that was mentioned in an email, and they said they were going to look into it some more, was because the pipe dimensional changes that had to be done, you know, to meet the second flow test requirements in the design. 898 01:58:56.950 --> 01:59:06.250 Kriss Grisham: the sales guy, his name's Melvin, said that they're going to take a look at that, and it may… we may have to adjust some of the costs for larger pipes. 899 01:59:06.360 --> 01:59:08.840 Kriss Grisham: But, you know, I'm not… 900 01:59:09.200 --> 01:59:16.020 Kriss Grisham: I'm not thinking that that's going to be much at all. If it is, so, yeah. 901 01:59:16.240 --> 01:59:17.980 Kriss Grisham: That's kind of where we're at. 902 01:59:20.840 --> 01:59:33.559 John Compton: Okay, and I think the Council should also be aware that in the process of preparing the hall, for the, the sprinkler replacement. 903 01:59:33.740 --> 01:59:40.270 John Compton: It opened up the opportunity to consider some additional upgrades. 904 01:59:40.380 --> 01:59:46.369 John Compton: One of them was the lights in the old conference room, 905 01:59:46.940 --> 01:59:54.289 John Compton: It was… it was recommended that we change the lighting cans to LED. 906 01:59:54.590 --> 02:00:10.790 John Compton: Fixtures. Yeah, yeah, it's bad Christmas now showing a piece of wood that was discovered next to one of those cans, charred, so clearly something got pretty dang hot, and enough to char the wood, which is a pretty… 907 02:00:10.860 --> 02:00:26.389 John Compton: frightening thought. So, the LED cans are much lower, heat output, much safer. They're also a different design, of course. So, we're gonna put in new cans. The ceiling's being replaced with new wood, that's what, Chris told you about. 908 02:00:26.760 --> 02:00:28.530 John Compton: In the main hall. 909 02:00:29.140 --> 02:00:34.379 John Compton: several items were discussed. We… 910 02:00:34.790 --> 02:00:44.389 John Compton: Did some research on, and have decided to replace the fans with a… with larger, larger, a more… 911 02:00:44.870 --> 02:00:49.050 John Compton: Slightly, zoomier design. Still wood. 912 02:00:49.200 --> 02:00:54.599 John Compton: Which should certainly fit the hall just fine. So we're gonna put new fans in. 913 02:00:54.790 --> 02:01:02.500 John Compton: In addition, it's an opportunity to, put in some insulation batting. 914 02:01:02.710 --> 02:01:05.030 John Compton: Above the lower ceiling. 915 02:01:05.300 --> 02:01:07.169 John Compton: Everyone knows there's the… 916 02:01:07.370 --> 02:01:24.389 John Compton: wooden ceiling that you see, and then there's access to the, among other things, the sprinkler system, but also all the way up to the roof, and there's no insulation. So, the opportunity to put some insulation in, put a foot of insulation 917 02:01:24.680 --> 02:01:29.520 John Compton: In most of the ceiling, the… 918 02:01:30.380 --> 02:01:45.339 John Compton: I guess Steve put down, or somebody has put down, plywood on the rafters to be able to work with the sprinkler pipes under that, so in that area, you can't… if we're gonna leave those 919 02:01:45.450 --> 02:01:57.050 John Compton: the plywood for walking on. It's going to leave it there. You can't put 12 inches, you can only put a thinner, but plan is to do all of that. All of that is relatively 920 02:01:57.160 --> 02:02:11.380 John Compton: small expense compared to the whole overall project. So, that's… the plan, is to do those additional things. There may be more, as… as… as things are looked to put together. 921 02:02:14.810 --> 02:02:17.540 John Compton: All right, if there's no further questions, I'll move on. 922 02:02:17.870 --> 02:02:22.099 John Compton: And our next item is re-approval of locking the tennis court gates. 923 02:02:22.220 --> 02:02:29.770 John Compton: There is an option on the, before the Council to, to, 924 02:02:29.890 --> 02:02:38.379 John Compton: Make, lock, the gate locks, a, a permanent, fixture. 925 02:02:38.590 --> 02:02:42.949 John Compton: And so the council is… 926 02:02:43.130 --> 02:02:48.979 John Compton: We're at the point of, of continuing, discussion of that motion. 927 02:02:49.500 --> 02:02:51.850 John Compton: You all are aware 928 02:02:51.970 --> 02:02:59.820 John Compton: I said at the top of the meeting that there, we requested and received a significant 929 02:02:59.940 --> 02:03:03.400 John Compton: The number of input on this, 930 02:03:04.560 --> 02:03:13.820 John Compton: It was divided between the two issues. One was, should residents… because one of… one of the rationales was locking it to prevent not… 931 02:03:14.180 --> 02:03:26.720 John Compton: non-residents, the thought was from… from using the court. That's not the case. Resident… non-residents are not allowed… are not permitted to use the courts already. It has nothing to do with this motion. 932 02:03:27.170 --> 02:03:36.190 John Compton: This motion is to, try and protect the courts from damage by non-tennis court use. 933 02:03:36.340 --> 02:03:40.450 John Compton: Of the facility, so… Oh. 934 02:03:41.010 --> 02:03:51.169 John Compton: the… I'm just going to summarize. It's been… it's clear that if we're locking the courts, obviously you have to have access to the combination. 935 02:03:51.450 --> 02:03:53.659 John Compton: So, there will… 936 02:03:53.780 --> 02:04:02.119 John Compton: There will be, if we prove this, there will be signs at the gates indicating who to call 937 02:04:02.310 --> 02:04:03.790 John Compton: More than one person. 938 02:04:03.950 --> 02:04:06.360 John Compton: Get the combination to the gate. 939 02:04:06.720 --> 02:04:11.010 John Compton: And those people will just be responsible for determining whether it's a resident or not. 940 02:04:11.380 --> 02:04:15.290 John Compton: So the idea is not to, make it difficult to get in. 941 02:04:15.450 --> 02:04:24.009 John Compton: But to simply ensure that it's for the use of tennis courts for tennis, or the garden, for that matter. 942 02:04:26.710 --> 02:04:35.270 John Compton: Okay, with that preamble, any… Discussion on the motion to, To roof-locking tennis. 943 02:04:38.480 --> 02:04:39.220 John Compton: Barber. 944 02:04:39.700 --> 02:04:50.709 Barbara: I oppose the motion to continue to lock them. A few years ago, we passed a resolution saying we were going to try to make our town more welcoming. 945 02:04:50.800 --> 02:05:06.159 Barbara: And even though the rule says non-residents are not allowed to use the court, having a lock on it really sends the message of exclusion. Later tonight, we may be discussing, 946 02:05:06.160 --> 02:05:07.939 Kathy Lehman: A statement about. 947 02:05:07.950 --> 02:05:13.410 Barbara: Welcoming immigrants and protecting their rights, and it seems like… 948 02:05:13.410 --> 02:05:29.599 Barbara: We want to protect immigrants and welcome them, but we don't want to welcome them into our facilities. So, I just really think it sends the wrong signal. I have… I've seen the photographs of the purported damage, and… 949 02:05:30.110 --> 02:05:44.229 Barbara: We don't know who's doing that damage. There are things like wheel marks on the court, which… I don't see how that's damaged. So I just don't really see any good reasons why we want to do that. 950 02:05:48.390 --> 02:05:49.120 John Compton: Thank you. 951 02:05:49.850 --> 02:06:01.369 Peter Nagrod: I would… I'm kind of neutral on the tennis courts slash pickleball courts, but I researched the clay courts, and there is not one facility 952 02:06:01.460 --> 02:06:13.240 Peter Nagrod: in Maryland, as far as I can see, that has a clay court that's open to the public. A clay court is very high maintenance, it's expensive, and it's very easy 953 02:06:13.340 --> 02:06:19.100 Peter Nagrod: To, if you don't have the right shoes on, or… it's very easy to cause a lot of damage to it. 954 02:06:19.230 --> 02:06:37.690 Peter Nagrod: And I… and I mean, it's ironic saying we're locking the clay course, because anybody can just go with that little fence anyway. But it does keep out… it does keep out dogs, hopefully, unless they can jump the fence. But I… I mean, I definitely, can't imagine why we would, 955 02:06:37.890 --> 02:06:42.020 Peter Nagrod: let that be open. And I think, John, you know. 956 02:06:42.240 --> 02:06:46.920 Peter Nagrod: Yeah, Barbara, I always try to agree with Barbara. 957 02:06:46.920 --> 02:06:56.840 Peter Nagrod: But in this case here, I think that, you know, there's certain things that you can just go too far with trying to do certain things. I think the town is incredibly. 958 02:06:56.840 --> 02:07:11.930 Peter Nagrod: welcoming compared to… I can't imagine a town anywhere that is more welcoming to other people than Washington Grove is, and I think that our playground group is making, you know, is really showcasing what the town is trying to do to invite our neighbors. 959 02:07:11.940 --> 02:07:14.300 Peter Nagrod: So, yo. 960 02:07:14.620 --> 02:07:32.729 Peter Nagrod: My point… my point was what you made, is that if we want to open the courts to outsiders, then we need to go back into the original ordinances and look at changing that, not… not do an ad hoc thing right now with the tennis courts. 961 02:07:35.600 --> 02:07:36.320 John Compton: Mary. 962 02:07:37.200 --> 02:07:48.209 Mary W: As you said, John, it's kind of two separate issues, locking it and who can access the tennis court, so I think if the original reason that we locked it was to protect 963 02:07:48.310 --> 02:07:50.450 Mary W: Protect the courts, 964 02:07:50.650 --> 02:08:01.170 Mary W: That really hasn't changed, but I think the next step should be, should we open it to non-residents, and how do we go about doing that? And I agree with you, Barbara, that 965 02:08:02.370 --> 02:08:11.040 Mary W: against the things that we've been trying to do, which is be more welcoming to residents, but I think, you know, there is a lot of, 966 02:08:11.140 --> 02:08:20.800 Mary W: Suggestions offered about, you know, the sign-up sheet, so that, you know, non-residents could access it. 967 02:08:21.400 --> 02:08:39.510 Mary W: And again, there's, you know, different municipalities that have done it differently. I don't have to reinvent the wheel, but I think my main point is I think it's separate. I think locking, we decided that that made sense for the reasons that we voted on it, and, you know, separate out who can use it, 968 02:08:40.450 --> 02:08:41.200 Mary W: Nope. 969 02:08:44.510 --> 02:08:45.190 John Compton: Okay. 970 02:08:47.080 --> 02:08:51.960 John Compton: Let's see, we've heard from 3 on the council. Chris or John, you have any, 971 02:08:52.520 --> 02:08:54.129 John Compton: Anything you wanted to say about this? 972 02:08:55.740 --> 02:08:57.200 johnporter: I think it's been set. 973 02:08:58.870 --> 02:08:59.650 John Compton: I'm sorry? 974 02:09:00.280 --> 02:09:01.610 johnporter: Nothing, nothing to add. 975 02:09:01.610 --> 02:09:02.519 John Compton: Oh, thank you. 976 02:09:02.800 --> 02:09:03.520 John Compton: Chris? 977 02:09:04.060 --> 02:09:08.189 Kriss Grisham: No, same here, I think. Well, I… 978 02:09:09.480 --> 02:09:16.990 Kriss Grisham: The town is paying maintenance and upkeep, and we even talked about trying to repair the cracks. 979 02:09:17.580 --> 02:09:21.499 Kriss Grisham: And, you know, if there is being, you know, 980 02:09:21.830 --> 02:09:27.060 Kriss Grisham: Damage, and there is, to the courts, and… 981 02:09:27.800 --> 02:09:30.609 Kriss Grisham: You know, locking the gates helps, maybe… 982 02:09:32.230 --> 02:09:39.950 Kriss Grisham: That's more towards, I guess, leaning towards locking the gates, but I think 983 02:09:40.470 --> 02:09:51.200 Kriss Grisham: you know, as other councils have said, and John, you too, that this is a totally different issue of being welcoming versus locking the gates. I think locking the gates is more… 984 02:09:51.350 --> 02:09:56.630 Kriss Grisham: From a… safe… safety? 985 02:09:56.830 --> 02:09:59.300 Kriss Grisham: And maintenance perspective. 986 02:10:00.820 --> 02:10:09.990 johnporter: So, if I could, I would only like to say one thing, and that is to all the town residents who wrote so passionately about this. The letters were… 987 02:10:10.710 --> 02:10:15.470 johnporter: Oftentimes, extremely well written, well thought out, and… 988 02:10:15.640 --> 02:10:21.569 johnporter: Really, really appreciated all the effort that went into that, those, those, those letters. 989 02:10:21.950 --> 02:10:26.280 johnporter: So, kudos to everybody who has an opinion on this. 990 02:10:28.810 --> 02:10:29.990 John Compton: Okay. 991 02:10:30.770 --> 02:10:31.320 Peter Nagrod: Damn. 992 02:10:31.670 --> 02:10:35.089 Peter Nagrod: Yeah, just one other thing is that the tennis courts 993 02:10:35.200 --> 02:10:39.290 Peter Nagrod: The tennis courts aren't used very often. 994 02:10:39.350 --> 02:10:50.120 Peter Nagrod: So, it's not… it's not really a capacity thing, it hasn't been anyway. But with pickleball becoming so popular, and it's gonna continue to become more and more popular. 995 02:10:50.120 --> 02:11:04.409 Peter Nagrod: It is very awkward when you have your group going down into the play, and there's somebody else already on the court. And, you know, this is… tennis, there's a million tennis courts everywhere, and better courts than ours. 996 02:11:04.780 --> 02:11:11.349 Peter Nagrod: We have a cute little pickleball area here, which I think is very attractive to, you know, people. 997 02:11:11.610 --> 02:11:18.060 Peter Nagrod: And it's gonna… it's… that could be a problem in the future, too. So… yeah. 998 02:11:18.460 --> 02:11:19.989 John Compton: I'm done barber, yeah. 999 02:11:19.990 --> 02:11:22.420 Barbara: Yeah, so I have just one more comment. 1000 02:11:22.450 --> 02:11:26.010 Barbara: The, resolution that was… 1001 02:11:26.010 --> 02:11:50.700 Barbara: the ordinance restricting the tennis courts to residents talks about, having them being used on a first-come, first-served basis. So I know people are talking about a reservation system, and Peter, you just said, oh, sometimes other people are already there. Well, if it's first-come, first-served, that's how it works, and a reservation system should not be implemented because it flies in the face of 1002 02:11:50.700 --> 02:11:51.979 Barbara: of that. 1003 02:11:51.980 --> 02:11:57.970 Peter Nagrod: But those other people… yeah, I agree with you, but I'm just going back to the original comment about 1004 02:11:58.220 --> 02:12:08.590 Peter Nagrod: We don't allow other people to use the court, so they shouldn't be there in the first place. And if people know that it's locked, you wouldn't have that situation. 1005 02:12:09.280 --> 02:12:26.449 Peter Nagrod: And I mean, I just know that most communities that aren't, you know, like, not a town as big as Gatesburg or Rockville, but, like, you know, the people who live in their own little communities, say, like, over at, the Kentlands, or Kings Farm, or, you know, any place that has courts, they're usually locked. 1006 02:12:26.600 --> 02:12:30.040 Peter Nagrod: Those are private courts. Those are… 1007 02:12:30.040 --> 02:12:33.270 Barbara: Homeowners association, and their municipality, which is just. 1008 02:12:33.270 --> 02:12:46.170 Peter Nagrod: Yeah, well, I know, but we… we're the same size or smaller than those… those communities. Okay, no, I'm not… like I said, I'm… I'm fine with whatever we do. I just think the clay courts, though, should be protected. 1009 02:12:46.840 --> 02:12:51.859 John Compton: I don't vote, but I, I do have a comment that, 1010 02:12:52.470 --> 02:12:58.879 John Compton: You know, the first come, first serve is indeed in our resolution. 1011 02:12:59.830 --> 02:13:07.079 John Compton: Which could be changed. If… if we had a… a easy-to-use sign-up system. 1012 02:13:07.790 --> 02:13:18.090 John Compton: Then the idea of non-residents using the courts would become more tractable. You could keep the courts locked. 1013 02:13:18.290 --> 02:13:33.310 John Compton: But if there's a sign-up system, and you allowed anybody to sign up, you could then determine whether or not the demand from residents versus non-residents, impacted the use of the course. 1014 02:13:33.720 --> 02:13:37.029 John Compton: So, right now, we don't allow that, we don't have a sign-up system. 1015 02:13:37.400 --> 02:13:53.040 John Compton: So, when it comes time to, you know, discuss whether or not we should open it up to non-residents, I'm, I'm thinking that a reservation or sign-up system might make that decision easier. 1016 02:13:53.350 --> 02:13:58.880 johnporter: I did some research on this, and there are security systems just for… 1017 02:13:59.010 --> 02:14:18.530 johnporter: tennis courts that combine locking mechanisms and a sign-up system to get an instant passcode to the court that is… that is updated on a continuing basis. So a passcode right now is not the same passcode as from an hour from now when you make a reservation. 1018 02:14:18.650 --> 02:14:25.370 johnporter: I'm not sure what the expense of those systems, but they're prevalent in sporting facilities. 1019 02:14:26.430 --> 02:14:27.970 John Compton: Anyway, that's for a discussion. 1020 02:14:27.970 --> 02:14:29.060 johnporter: Yeah, another time. 1021 02:14:29.060 --> 02:14:32.500 John Compton: Relevant for, for… . 1022 02:14:33.250 --> 02:14:34.520 Kathy Lehman: non-resident. 1023 02:14:34.520 --> 02:14:37.800 John Compton: You know, welcoming everyone to use a sign-up system. 1024 02:14:40.200 --> 02:14:46.229 John Compton: If there are no further comments, we'll move to a vote on continuation of the locking of the courts. 1025 02:14:46.360 --> 02:14:47.970 John Compton: All in favor? 1026 02:14:50.990 --> 02:14:53.919 johnporter: Repeat what we're voting? Are we voting in favor of the lock? 1027 02:14:55.050 --> 02:15:03.090 John Compton: You… the proposal is to continue locking the tennis courts. This is in favor, or… I guess. 1028 02:15:03.090 --> 02:15:09.280 Peter Nagrod: Well, can we… can we split that into… separating it into the clay court and the… 1029 02:15:09.680 --> 02:15:11.860 Peter Nagrod: as I'm trying to point out, and the art… 1030 02:15:11.860 --> 02:15:16.889 John Compton: propose an amendment to Carsage, you're welcome to propose an amendment. 1031 02:15:19.090 --> 02:15:21.370 Peter Nagrod: Yes, I would propose that amendment then. 1032 02:15:21.570 --> 02:15:25.120 Kathy Lehman: That we have two votes, one for the clay courts and one for the hard court. 1033 02:15:29.890 --> 02:15:37.390 John Compton: Peter has proposed to amend the motion to separate actions. 1034 02:15:37.680 --> 02:15:41.440 John Compton: For the clay court versus the hard court. 1035 02:15:41.720 --> 02:15:44.719 John Compton: Is there a second to the amendment report? 1036 02:15:44.720 --> 02:15:46.350 Barbara: I second it, Barbara. 1037 02:15:47.300 --> 02:15:48.190 John Compton: Okay. 1038 02:15:48.190 --> 02:15:53.000 Mary W: Can I just ask a ques… a question? People… 1039 02:15:53.440 --> 02:16:02.889 Mary W: Has there been any change with the fact that these courts have been locked? I mean, this was a trial period to see, you know, how it worked. I mean, has there been… 1040 02:16:04.630 --> 02:16:18.960 Mary W: complaints, or has there been any improvement in the amount of, you know, damage to the court, or… I guess we did a trial, and what… on what basis are we re… reexamining what we decided before? 1041 02:16:19.290 --> 02:16:27.869 John Compton: Let's ask those who pay attention. Meredith, you're still here, or have there been any new damage to the courts since the courts have been locked? 1042 02:16:32.290 --> 02:16:50.229 Meredith Horan: I noticed a couple things today. There's a mark that looks like somebody, it could be anything, it looks like a hammer hit it, like, it's not a crack. It's very strange. I have no idea how it got there. The system has worked ideally for us who use the quartz. 1043 02:16:50.510 --> 02:16:52.160 Meredith Horan: It's… 1044 02:16:52.340 --> 02:16:54.699 John Compton: Okay, the question was about damage, though. 1045 02:16:54.709 --> 02:16:59.209 Meredith Horan: Yeah, there are a couple things, and of course the cracks have gotten larger. 1046 02:16:59.209 --> 02:17:00.859 Peter Nagrod: What the… 1047 02:17:00.860 --> 02:17:01.610 Meredith Horan: You know. 1048 02:17:03.139 --> 02:17:05.409 John Compton: Linda, anything to contribute here? 1049 02:17:05.580 --> 02:17:06.170 Peter Nagrod: Duh. 1050 02:17:07.110 --> 02:17:14.510 John Hutchinson: I feel like there's far less damage and far… 1051 02:17:15.719 --> 02:17:18.850 John Hutchinson: You know, don't forget, we also have a garden area. 1052 02:17:18.980 --> 02:17:22.529 John Hutchinson: That people wander in, and that's up for grabs, too. 1053 02:17:26.260 --> 02:17:30.719 John Hutchinson: I have no idea how we're going to isolate the clay courts. 1054 02:17:31.670 --> 02:17:37.370 John Hutchinson: Without creating a system to keep outsiders. 1055 02:17:38.110 --> 02:17:43.290 John Hutchinson: From hopping over the fence, or doing stuff in the… on the clay courts. 1056 02:17:44.580 --> 02:17:50.400 John Hutchinson: So, in my mind, it's an entire area that needs more protection. 1057 02:17:54.450 --> 02:18:02.769 John Hutchinson: There's so many courts available in parks and other areas where people can play. 1058 02:18:03.320 --> 02:18:18.919 John Hutchinson: I think our situation here encourages outsiders to come play on… play on all the equipment, and then, oh, let's go into the tennis courts and see what's going on there. Let's kick balls around, let's hop over… 1059 02:18:18.920 --> 02:18:25.790 John Hutchinson: nets, let's pull the nets down, and that's the type of thing I've seen in the last so many years, is just… 1060 02:18:25.860 --> 02:18:30.380 John Hutchinson: Very, very difficult to monitor and to repair. 1061 02:18:32.660 --> 02:18:40.090 John Hutchinson: And I don't… I just think with the facilities available to everyone in this area. 1062 02:18:40.580 --> 02:18:44.139 John Hutchinson: And with ours being so small and specific. 1063 02:18:44.799 --> 02:18:49.860 John Hutchinson: I'd just like to see it in a better protected situation. 1064 02:18:50.830 --> 02:18:51.930 John Compton: Okay, thank you. 1065 02:18:53.430 --> 02:19:02.920 John Compton: All right, any of the Council comment that we have before the Council is an amendment to, consider the locking of the Clay Court separately from the hard courts. 1066 02:19:04.410 --> 02:19:09.019 John Compton: No further comments? All in favor of, amending the motion? 1067 02:19:09.240 --> 02:19:10.900 John Compton: As described? 1068 02:19:11.799 --> 02:19:15.589 John Compton: I see 1, 2, all opposed? 1069 02:19:18.020 --> 02:19:19.080 Mary W: C2… 1070 02:19:20.469 --> 02:19:24.539 John Compton: Abstain. Mary, you didn't vote. 1071 02:19:24.900 --> 02:19:25.889 Mary W: Oh, I did. 1072 02:19:26.260 --> 02:19:27.350 John Compton: What do you do that? 1073 02:19:28.110 --> 02:19:29.699 Mary W: I voted for it. 1074 02:19:30.480 --> 02:19:38.999 John Compton: for it. So that's 3 votes in favor of separate, actions, unlocking the play court and the tennis court. 1075 02:19:39.290 --> 02:19:47.310 John Compton: So, the motion's been, been amended, so let's handle the clay quartz. 1076 02:19:47.440 --> 02:19:48.230 John Compton: First. 1077 02:19:48.600 --> 02:19:53.380 John Compton: Do we have any further discussion on locking… continuing locking the clay quartz? 1078 02:19:55.140 --> 02:19:58.229 John Compton: Not all in favor of continuing locking the clay ports. 1079 02:19:58.930 --> 02:20:01.260 John Compton: And that's unanimous. 1080 02:20:01.630 --> 02:20:12.100 John Compton: All right, so the next, sec- second part of the action is continuing locking the hard court. Any further discussion? 1081 02:20:14.600 --> 02:20:20.499 John Compton: Okay, in that case, we'll vote on that. All in favor, continue locking the hard court. 1082 02:20:22.270 --> 02:20:24.360 John Compton: That's 3. Opposed? 1083 02:20:26.090 --> 02:20:30.080 John Compton: Alright, that passes, so both parts will continue to be locked. 1084 02:20:30.310 --> 02:20:38.860 John Compton: And the, the, we're gonna clarify the signage. 1085 02:20:39.290 --> 02:20:54.019 John Compton: To be sure that anyone who walks up to those and they can get in as a resident knows who to call, and it's more than one, one opportunity, more than one option to, get through the locked gate. 1086 02:20:54.580 --> 02:21:01.599 John Compton: And just to… Close it all out, the issue of non-resident use of the tennis courts. 1087 02:21:02.050 --> 02:21:09.409 John Compton: Continues to be the town policy until A proposal to change that. 1088 02:21:11.460 --> 02:21:12.190 John Compton: Thank you. 1089 02:21:13.770 --> 02:21:19.829 John Compton: Alright, next item on the administrative matters is Stream Crossing Safety Assessment. 1090 02:21:20.300 --> 02:21:29.490 John Compton: As you know, after the, the… what we're calling the Boy Scout Bridge, incident in the Westwoods. 1091 02:21:30.970 --> 02:21:43.479 John Compton: I created a safety panel to, look into safety standards for crossings of all of the streams on our trails in the woods. 1092 02:21:43.630 --> 02:21:51.800 John Compton: And they have produced a report and a recommendation. That group, consisted of… 1093 02:21:51.900 --> 02:21:56.250 John Compton: Where'd I go, of, chris? 1094 02:21:56.560 --> 02:21:58.870 John Compton: Addie… . 1095 02:21:59.560 --> 02:22:01.600 Peter Nagrod: and others. 1096 02:22:01.600 --> 02:22:07.400 John Compton: City Parks, state, was it just the three of you? Dave, yeah, Patty, and, and Chris. 1097 02:22:07.580 --> 02:22:11.290 John Compton: So the report was available in the materials. 1098 02:22:11.750 --> 02:22:19.319 John Compton: And, I'm… I'm not going to actually summarize that. 1099 02:22:19.490 --> 02:22:31.519 John Compton: Yes, I am going to summarize that. So they, they, they, they refer to and discuss some of the, the standards of, of, a variety of government 1100 02:22:31.710 --> 02:22:39.899 John Compton: Government-run, parks and… And facilities… 1101 02:22:40.000 --> 02:22:54.159 John Compton: And then examined several options for our crossings. The two were bridges, and the alternative was, was. 1102 02:22:54.160 --> 02:22:55.120 Kathy Lehman: verse. 1103 02:22:55.470 --> 02:23:02.200 John Compton: Culverts being to, direct the streams through a pipe. 1104 02:23:02.360 --> 02:23:04.300 John Compton: And to put trail. 1105 02:23:04.410 --> 02:23:09.950 John Compton: On the top of the pipe, so that the stream no longer interrupted the trail. 1106 02:23:11.730 --> 02:23:15.640 John Compton: And their recommendation was the town should consider. 1107 02:23:16.530 --> 02:23:18.650 John Compton: Installing Powerworks. 1108 02:23:19.230 --> 02:23:22.159 John Compton: In, in particular, in 3 locations. 1109 02:23:23.530 --> 02:23:28.160 John Compton: Having summarized that, that, that, report. 1110 02:23:28.310 --> 02:23:38.969 John Compton: We have Patty here, we have Chris here, so any questions from the Council concerning that, or… and or, I know we're going to have a motion, 1111 02:23:39.100 --> 02:23:42.850 John Compton: If you want to go right to the motion, we can discuss it in terms of the motion. 1112 02:23:43.100 --> 02:23:50.319 John Compton: But the panel report, really was a staff, quote, staff report. Any questions for… That ear, Chris. 1113 02:23:53.360 --> 02:24:04.719 Patrice Klein: Can I just make a quick comment, just for some perspective? I just wanted the Council to realize that what we put in this report was really pre-existing information. There's really… 1114 02:24:04.790 --> 02:24:17.670 Patrice Klein: In a sense, nothing new, particularly about the town's responsibility, the town meaning the town council, the government, and the committees involved. This was information that pre-existed. 1115 02:24:17.670 --> 02:24:26.410 Patrice Klein: that talked about the town's responsibility overall to maintain, you know, our… basically our town lands, right, and our trails and… 1116 02:24:26.670 --> 02:24:37.199 Patrice Klein: And those are stream crossing issues and making decisions about whether to put in bridges or culverts or crossings. And since at least 1983, from the information I 1117 02:24:37.420 --> 02:24:51.870 Patrice Klein: was able to find, the forestry committee, or various iterations of it, was given that responsibility to provide that general oversight and bring those concerns to the town council and the government if 1118 02:24:52.010 --> 02:25:01.500 Patrice Klein: stream crossings were necessary. The citations and all the other references are existing documents, guidelines, and standards by 1119 02:25:02.020 --> 02:25:03.410 Patrice Klein: recognized. 1120 02:25:03.500 --> 02:25:16.279 Patrice Klein: forestry and public land management organization, so I just hope that you see this was really an opportunity to distill and basically consolidate a lot of information that's already 1121 02:25:16.280 --> 02:25:26.429 Patrice Klein: Existing in our ordinances, in our charter, and some of the way the committees have, you know, been granted that oversight for years, and at least you have it all in one place. 1122 02:25:26.520 --> 02:25:29.619 Patrice Klein: And I was hoping that this was really about process. 1123 02:25:29.790 --> 02:25:48.570 Patrice Klein: And how we work through these kinds of decisions as we have for many years. So, you know, without picking any particular event that, you know, maybe triggered this, I think it's an opportunity to at least have this information all in one place to guide us in how we go forward. So, I hope that helps you. 1124 02:25:51.290 --> 02:25:58.330 Kriss Grisham: Can I… John, can I get you to put up the pictures in the report, maybe? So that… 1125 02:25:58.750 --> 02:25:59.729 John Compton: see the pictures? 1126 02:25:59.730 --> 02:26:02.690 Kriss Grisham: Yeah, so that the residents could see, you know, what… 1127 02:26:03.220 --> 02:26:05.989 Patrice Klein: I have the report if you… if you don't have it handy, I… if you… 1128 02:26:05.990 --> 02:26:06.579 John Compton: I have it in. 1129 02:26:06.580 --> 02:26:07.250 Patrice Klein: Okay. 1130 02:26:07.630 --> 02:26:08.380 Patrice Klein: Brilliant. 1131 02:26:08.380 --> 02:26:12.859 Kriss Grisham: And, and pretty much the, the great artwork that, John Porter… 1132 02:26:12.860 --> 02:26:13.949 John Compton: No, it's what… 1133 02:26:13.950 --> 02:26:14.520 Kriss Grisham: stand for it. 1134 02:26:14.520 --> 02:26:19.630 John Compton: It probably would be a shame not to, accidentally. 1135 02:26:20.460 --> 02:26:22.539 John Compton: Come on, John, where is it? 1136 02:26:29.230 --> 02:26:30.390 John Compton: There it is. 1137 02:26:32.050 --> 02:26:32.720 John Compton: There we go. 1138 02:26:32.880 --> 02:26:34.899 John Compton: It's in the report, right? 1139 02:26:34.900 --> 02:26:35.220 Kriss Grisham: Yo. 1140 02:26:35.220 --> 02:26:38.929 Patrice Klein: Yes, it is. It's in the back, the back end. 1141 02:26:41.000 --> 02:26:42.390 John Compton: Of course, I was preparing. 1142 02:26:46.100 --> 02:26:46.870 John Compton: Okay. 1143 02:26:48.140 --> 02:26:49.140 John Compton: machine. 1144 02:26:53.030 --> 02:26:57.460 John Compton: Alright, should be seeing the report, interests us, particularly the pictures. 1145 02:26:57.820 --> 02:26:59.060 John Compton: which are here. 1146 02:26:59.340 --> 02:27:00.410 John Compton: Go ahead, Chris. 1147 02:27:01.460 --> 02:27:05.040 John Compton: Well, I can, you know… this was, 1148 02:27:05.220 --> 02:27:13.840 John Compton: what the committee did is they took some pictures of some existing stream crossings on a trail. This is the Maple Trail Footbridge. 1149 02:27:14.150 --> 02:27:20.840 John Compton: And then, Our, resident, 1150 02:27:22.140 --> 02:27:26.210 John Compton: AI renderer known as John Porter. 1151 02:27:26.590 --> 02:27:28.770 John Compton: Created this. 1152 02:27:28.770 --> 02:27:29.160 Peter Nagrod: Nope. 1153 02:27:29.160 --> 02:27:35.640 John Compton: To show, this is not what it looks like today, but this is what it might look like if you use the culvert. 1154 02:27:35.640 --> 02:27:36.110 Peter Nagrod: No. 1155 02:27:37.930 --> 02:27:40.710 John Compton: So, it's a great… Looks as. 1156 02:27:40.710 --> 02:27:42.739 Patrice Klein: And the next one is an example with 1157 02:27:43.030 --> 02:27:48.670 Patrice Klein: You know, if you needed to have some handrails. Those are, you know, optional or site-specific. 1158 02:27:48.840 --> 02:27:51.260 Patrice Klein: And again, a lot of that is based on 1159 02:27:51.550 --> 02:27:55.500 Patrice Klein: The guidance documents that we reference, you know, those, 1160 02:27:56.710 --> 02:28:05.219 Patrice Klein: documents that have been prepared by National Park Service, Appalachian Trail Council, USDA Forest Service, I mean, all these, you know. 1161 02:28:06.070 --> 02:28:12.579 Patrice Klein: Land management, professional land management agencies that create these guidelines and standards. 1162 02:28:13.320 --> 02:28:32.369 Patrice Klein: Because they work with each other, and those are the professionals, right, that create and manage trails. One of the things I wanted to bring up is looking at Maple Avenue, footbridge. I mean, that footbridge has been there for a long time. We've actually had to repair it several times. Some of the foot planks get broken over… over the years. 1163 02:28:32.500 --> 02:28:35.710 Patrice Klein: And one of the questions that came up had to do with aesthetics. 1164 02:28:36.170 --> 02:28:52.690 Patrice Klein: not just functionality, but, you know, the aesthetics, right, of walking through our woods, and isn't it nice to walk over a footbridge? Well, yeah, I know. That one, frankly, is fortunately just kind of sitting on the banks of that stream that, fortunately, over that, stream along Maple Trail has not really 1165 02:28:52.760 --> 02:29:12.629 Patrice Klein: eroded, you know, significantly over time. It's very different in the Westwoods, for those of you who may not be familiar. The Eastwoods has been very fortunate. It's been buffered by our town residences and the neighborhoods around us, so that it is a floodplain, but it's not been really subject to a lot of the heavy flooding 1166 02:29:12.670 --> 02:29:19.720 Patrice Klein: that's going on right now in the Westwoods because of runoff from the roads and the other, townships around us. 1167 02:29:20.250 --> 02:29:32.229 Patrice Klein: So that little footbridge has kind of, you know, sustained itself for a long time. However, when you think about walking through the woods and just sort of being immersed in the woods, and you look at the culvert option that 1168 02:29:32.230 --> 02:29:41.710 Patrice Klein: that John provided. It just seems to me, it sort of blends in more nicely than that sort of, you know, footbridge that's just kind of plunked there. 1169 02:29:41.720 --> 02:29:46.089 Patrice Klein: the footbridge has served its purpose, you know, for a while. I've also noticed that 1170 02:29:46.290 --> 02:30:00.310 Patrice Klein: Over time, folks who have been riding bicycles on that trail in particular, they didn't like to go over the footbridge, because there's a little bit of a step up, and what they have done over the years is they basically did a crosscut across the stream in front of that. 1171 02:30:00.310 --> 02:30:10.980 Patrice Klein: And they have actually created some erosion on the stream banks over some years. And you can't maybe appreciate it, but on the other side of the footbridge towards the back of that photograph. 1172 02:30:11.140 --> 02:30:20.630 Patrice Klein: people have actually just taken their bike and just, you know, ridden, excuse me, across the stream, and they created a lot of erosion. We've tried to put up 1173 02:30:20.950 --> 02:30:29.720 Patrice Klein: Hurricane fencing and other obstacles over the years, but some people just decided they didn't want to have to deal with the footbridge, so they carved their own path. 1174 02:30:30.190 --> 02:30:40.110 Patrice Klein: So, you know, as far as the Woods Committee goes, we've been monitoring and maintaining the existing footbridges, and even there's a couple of culverts. 1175 02:30:40.220 --> 02:30:44.959 Patrice Klein: You can look at the map, John, if you want to, you know, scroll back down to the Eastwoods map. 1176 02:30:45.320 --> 02:31:07.170 Patrice Klein: We already have where all those yellow X's are. Those are where some of the footbridges are, like the one I just showed you on Maple Trail. There's also a couple of culverts that have been in the Eastwoods, some for quite a long time. There's, right now, if you look at the Franklin Culvert, that's a corrugated metal culvert. That pre-exists me, and I've been here for 30 years. 1177 02:31:07.240 --> 02:31:23.309 Patrice Klein: That metal culvert is actually collapsing on itself. It's rusted, it's metal, it's corroded, it, you know, it's past its life expectancy. So, something needs to be done there anyway, and we'll likely try to replace it with another culvert, because culverts seem to be… 1178 02:31:23.490 --> 02:31:28.680 Patrice Klein: Not kind of a one-size-fits-all, but they're much simpler, to… 1179 02:31:29.240 --> 02:31:42.720 Patrice Klein: To engineer in a way, or to create and to place, and they sort of fit well with our woods, in that when you're walking across a stream crossing with a culvert, you don't even realize, you know, it just kind of blends in with the background. 1180 02:31:43.080 --> 02:31:59.190 Patrice Klein: We'll have to put some riprap in there as well. The one up at Bradfield, Bradford Crossing at the upper right-hand corner, that one is a relatively new one because we had to create that when that little stream was getting a little more, widened or deeper. 1181 02:31:59.190 --> 02:32:06.530 Patrice Klein: And we had to, actually reroute an older crossing to a safer spot. And that is, right now, a black. 1182 02:32:06.650 --> 02:32:08.400 Kathy Lehman: Plastic corrugated. 1183 02:32:09.580 --> 02:32:24.100 Patrice Klein: culvert. I had some extra photos, John, you may not have, you know, decided to have those available, but if you ever go back into that section of the Eastwoods, you don't even recognize what you're walking over, but it becomes just a lovely, easy. 1184 02:32:24.170 --> 02:32:26.330 Patrice Klein: Path to get across the little stream. 1185 02:32:26.340 --> 02:32:39.240 Patrice Klein: So, just a suggestion, we talk in the report about the pros and cons of both bridges and culverts. We came up with a recommendation to prioritize for our purposes, for our cost. 1186 02:32:39.240 --> 02:32:55.389 Patrice Klein: for our labor, for our maintenance, is that culverts seem to… yeah, that's the Bradford Crossing. And you can't even tell that it's there, unless you really look towards the foreground. You'll see a little, sort of black corrugated pipe that's kind of sticking out, there you go, towards that sort of front right corner. 1187 02:32:55.900 --> 02:33:11.510 Patrice Klein: And otherwise, because that's at a time when some of the, you know, vegetation is overgrown in the summer. But otherwise, you're walking across that, and you know the stream's on opposite sides of you, but, you know, it's safe, and it's just packed with dirt, and it lasts for a long time. 1188 02:33:11.600 --> 02:33:21.289 Patrice Klein: So, we had prioritized the use of culverts as, sort of a priority first, because a lot of our streams are relatively small and easily 1189 02:33:21.430 --> 02:33:29.259 Patrice Klein: Maintained with culverts. But again, that's for your information, and we explain more in the report. 1190 02:33:29.490 --> 02:33:43.840 Patrice Klein: you know, the pros and cons between the costs for constructing bridges and maintaining bridges, and also how they do and do not actually reinforce the stream banks underneath. Culverts will. A full pipe culvert. 1191 02:33:43.900 --> 02:33:49.900 Patrice Klein: actually protects the entire stream bank with the rep wrap on either end of it. So, I'll stop there. 1192 02:33:50.210 --> 02:33:51.150 John Compton: Thank you. 1193 02:33:53.040 --> 02:33:58.879 John Compton: All right, so, the recommendations were to use culverts, 1194 02:34:00.950 --> 02:34:07.079 John Compton: Chris, you, you, you expressed the intention to make… to make a motion, 1195 02:34:08.570 --> 02:34:12.299 John Compton: Do you want to go ahead and do that, at this time, or not? 1196 02:34:12.300 --> 02:34:17.519 Kriss Grisham: Yeah, yeah, if I could, to get a vote, I make a motion. 1197 02:34:17.710 --> 02:34:19.840 Kriss Grisham: To adopt and approve. 1198 02:34:20.120 --> 02:34:29.299 Kriss Grisham: The recommendation in… in the East-Westwoods Stream Crossing Safety Assessment Document. 1199 02:34:30.550 --> 02:34:31.290 John Compton: Right. 1200 02:34:31.290 --> 02:34:36.970 Peter Nagrod: So, alright, so, I have a huge amount of. 1201 02:34:36.970 --> 02:34:40.320 Kriss Grisham: frustration that I'm trying not to show right now. 1202 02:34:40.360 --> 02:34:47.520 Peter Nagrod: in that… we… I… I… 5 times a week in the summer, I run… 1203 02:34:48.060 --> 02:35:01.750 Peter Nagrod: past the lake, down the… past the dog park, down into Kelly Park, and back, and I meet some of the other grovers who run that. And it is so aggravating. Every time there's one very deep. 1204 02:35:02.350 --> 02:35:07.629 Peter Nagrod: gully-type thing there, which is incredibly dangerous, and for… 1205 02:35:07.900 --> 02:35:19.809 Peter Nagrod: ever since I've been here, it's been difficult to get across there. It's also difficult sometimes if you go along the lake to get to Kelly Park the other way. And what I find really frustrating is that 1206 02:35:20.320 --> 02:35:35.449 Peter Nagrod: that is one of the most… those two are used a lot by people not in town to get across. And, you know, you want to talk about DEI, and you want to talk about how we treat our neighbors. 1207 02:35:35.670 --> 02:35:48.409 Peter Nagrod: there's no way of getting there, and when Whetstone was done, once again, you know, Grove residents don't go down there. They don't see it, but it's part of our town, it's a big part of the Westwoods. 1208 02:35:48.410 --> 02:36:00.369 Peter Nagrod: And the Boy Scout bridge that was put up was over a very easy thing to get across. That other one is very difficult, talk about liability, you can talk about whatever you want, but… 1209 02:36:00.390 --> 02:36:09.329 Peter Nagrod: you know, I think that now that we're talking about the bridges, I'm just disappointed that that crossing did not even come into the conversation. 1210 02:36:09.680 --> 02:36:11.320 Peter Nagrod: And it's just… 1211 02:36:11.670 --> 02:36:18.399 Peter Nagrod: I just don't understand. You know, there's been some attempts as far as putting something up there, but… 1212 02:36:18.840 --> 02:36:26.950 Peter Nagrod: You know, I just think that we need to look at that crossing and make that accessible for our neighbors and for the people of the town to get across there. 1213 02:36:26.950 --> 02:36:29.949 John Compton: I'm showing a map here. Yeah, sure. 1214 02:36:29.950 --> 02:36:44.910 Patrice Klein: May I comment? I think you're talking about on the Whetstone Trail, there's a very wide, you know, excessively eroded… used to be a smaller stream, if you're staying on the Whetstone Trail. I know exactly what you're talking about. I know you do. And my point being is. 1215 02:36:44.910 --> 02:36:45.380 Peter Nagrod: Yeah. 1216 02:36:45.380 --> 02:36:55.020 Patrice Klein: Between that, and I call it the trench that goes along the lake, right? The trench that goes along the lake, thank God, years, 70 years ago, Steve rebuilt the culvert, right, that. 1217 02:36:55.020 --> 02:36:55.520 Peter Nagrod: Excellent. 1218 02:36:55.520 --> 02:37:13.099 Patrice Klein: get into the lake entrance, that's fine. Still, the trench itself is problematic as far as, like you said, walking along the fence line to get over towards Kelly Park. The reason that we haven't pursued that Whetstone Trail stream crossing, which has now eroded 1219 02:37:13.150 --> 02:37:24.039 Patrice Klein: stream banks, and if you go down on a diagonal, and you come up on the other side. We haven't done that because we also, in parallel, have been doing that Westwoods environmental 1220 02:37:24.710 --> 02:37:34.410 Patrice Klein: assessment. We didn't want to start building anything there. Granted, it still is a major concern, until we figured out how we were going to control 1221 02:37:34.930 --> 02:37:45.519 Patrice Klein: all of this flooding, and basically stream erosion, and the water that's coming into the Westwoods, if we were starting to build a bridge, we might have to do something. 1222 02:37:46.370 --> 02:37:51.830 John Compton: Let me, let me, I mean, in the interest of time, this isn't the place to debate whether. 1223 02:37:52.380 --> 02:38:05.280 John Compton: you know, whether or not that should be included in, in the, you know, work plan with this. What, what, Chris was talking about was this… 1224 02:38:05.590 --> 02:38:08.799 John Compton: let's get out of here. 1225 02:38:12.430 --> 02:38:18.539 John Compton: No, I'm… Can't seem to… alright, there. 1226 02:38:18.770 --> 02:38:28.710 John Compton: is… is this recommendation here, to do… use the culverts where they indicate some expense? 1227 02:38:29.110 --> 02:38:38.449 John Compton: Which is useful to know. Okay, so they are, they're talking about, culverts. What are we talking about in expense? Here it is. 1228 02:38:39.380 --> 02:38:41.880 John Compton: You know, 1,000 to $1,500 per pipe. 1229 02:38:42.050 --> 02:38:52.539 John Compton: Some rep wrap, that is some, some stones on either side to make sure that the, the culvert's not, you know, eroded away, and some labor. 1230 02:38:53.250 --> 02:38:55.640 John Compton: So, budget-wise, 1231 02:38:56.050 --> 02:39:04.489 John Compton: Probably the Woods budget, or some other budget would support doing some of these, in fiscal 26. 1232 02:39:04.670 --> 02:39:14.120 John Compton: If you want to actually do it intentionally and delay till 27, it could be put into the budget with that in that way. 1233 02:39:14.380 --> 02:39:17.759 John Compton: But, that's where their recommendations are. 1234 02:39:19.190 --> 02:39:25.230 John Compton: So, Chris, where are we? You were… Saying something about… 1235 02:39:25.470 --> 02:39:37.449 Kriss Grisham: Well, I guess… so, bottom line, regarding budget, too, you know, Patty and I were talking, and it seems like there's some money in the woods budget that could cover at least two. 1236 02:39:37.450 --> 02:39:48.220 Kriss Grisham: immediate needs, and then we could, you know, look at putting, or requesting, I guess, to put more money in to do some others in the next fiscal year. 1237 02:39:48.220 --> 02:39:49.380 Patrice Klein: We could cover it. 1238 02:39:49.810 --> 02:39:50.750 Patrice Klein: It's not a problem. 1239 02:39:51.310 --> 02:39:53.170 Kriss Grisham: So… Yeah. 1240 02:39:53.170 --> 02:39:58.309 Patrice Klein: Notwithstanding Peter's comment, which is important, is that that's a major 1241 02:39:58.970 --> 02:40:13.870 Patrice Klein: construction project. Bridge or whatever, Peter, okay? And until we figure out how to deal with the stream restoration issues in the Westwoods ongoing, you're right. It's something that we may have to tackle separately, because it's going to be a major construction. 1242 02:40:14.080 --> 02:40:18.200 John Compton: Let me suggest that that be brought up, as a separate discussion. 1243 02:40:18.200 --> 02:40:18.630 Peter Nagrod: Okay. 1244 02:40:19.040 --> 02:40:32.949 John Compton: You're, you want to forward that, suggest it for the agenda, as to, you know, you heard what Patty's feeling was, at least for now. Chris is simply, looking, I… I guess, I think you were looking for counsel, 1245 02:40:33.240 --> 02:40:33.970 John Compton: Wow. 1246 02:40:35.260 --> 02:40:38.540 John Compton: agreement that, moving ahead with COVID's 1247 02:40:38.650 --> 02:40:42.109 John Compton: In… in the… the… at least the three… 1248 02:40:42.220 --> 02:40:47.250 John Compton: That were named, would be, Okay, yeah. 1249 02:40:48.010 --> 02:40:48.730 John Compton: Appropriate. 1250 02:40:49.430 --> 02:40:53.389 Peter Nagrod: Why is this even a council? Like, I could see this being a council 1251 02:40:53.550 --> 02:41:03.199 Peter Nagrod: I mean, it's great information, and it's great work, but this is like a repair, and it's in the budget. Why are we… you know, we don't… we don't have to vote on it, right? 1252 02:41:03.660 --> 02:41:04.070 Kriss Grisham: Well. 1253 02:41:04.070 --> 02:41:11.000 John Compton: Okay, so you want the Woods Committee to just do it, and then you're going to say, oh my god, why did they do that? 1254 02:41:11.000 --> 02:41:14.480 Peter Nagrod: And not do the bridge I want? Okay. There he said that. 1255 02:41:14.480 --> 02:41:24.920 John Compton: I mean, you know, this is a… it's, it's… it's better for the council to say, you know, looks good to us, you know. Okay. 1256 02:41:25.060 --> 02:41:28.319 Peter Nagrod: Yeah. This is, I think… Looks good. Okay. 1257 02:41:29.200 --> 02:41:31.960 John Compton: So make a motion. 1258 02:41:32.410 --> 02:41:33.330 John Compton: Specifically. 1259 02:41:33.330 --> 02:41:36.650 Kathy Lehman: We still have a motion on the table that Chris did, right? 1260 02:41:36.650 --> 02:41:38.719 John Compton: I wasn't. That's what I was trying to do. 1261 02:41:38.720 --> 02:41:45.420 Kathy Lehman: Motion to adopt and approve the recommendations Used in the report. 1262 02:41:46.370 --> 02:41:49.600 John Compton: That's as vague as I could get, because I couldn't catch it all. 1263 02:41:50.430 --> 02:41:51.180 Kriss Grisham: That's it. 1264 02:41:51.180 --> 02:41:52.570 Peter Nagrod: Okay. 1265 02:41:53.000 --> 02:41:54.250 Kathy Lehman: And there was no subject. 1266 02:41:55.260 --> 02:41:58.360 John Compton: Okay, then that does deal with 4… 1267 02:41:58.500 --> 02:42:07.000 John Compton: I'll show it again, just so you know what the rec… when you're adopting the report and recommendations, this is what you get. 1268 02:42:07.530 --> 02:42:08.280 John Compton: air. 1269 02:42:09.540 --> 02:42:19.159 John Compton: the three, footbridges, and one-to-one culvert to be, have new culvert work, and the Westwood Poplar Trail 1270 02:42:19.370 --> 02:42:25.319 John Compton: To, install, A culvert in price of the Boy Scout footprint. 1271 02:42:26.190 --> 02:42:33.629 Patrice Klein: Peter, look at the last sentence. It says that this is ongoing, right? This is part of a safety committee issue as well. 1272 02:42:33.800 --> 02:42:35.680 John Compton: We'll work with the Safety Committee. 1273 02:42:36.980 --> 02:42:39.020 Peter Nagrod: So, what's the total cost of this? 1274 02:42:41.730 --> 02:42:43.110 John Compton: $10,000, probably. 1275 02:42:48.410 --> 02:42:53.700 Patrice Klein: Or less. Depends on… Steve's here. Steve is our, logistics guy. 1276 02:42:54.600 --> 02:42:57.789 Peter Nagrod: Well, who's gonna do the work? Are we gonna put it out to bid, or… 1277 02:42:58.580 --> 02:43:00.569 John Compton: I heard you volunteer. 1278 02:43:00.970 --> 02:43:04.449 Kriss Grisham: Bring your, your bucket, wheelbarrow. 1279 02:43:04.450 --> 02:43:06.590 Peter Nagrod: No, seriously, like, who's… 1280 02:43:06.590 --> 02:43:07.500 Kriss Grisham: So, if you took a. 1281 02:43:07.500 --> 02:43:19.650 John Compton: You know who will do the work. We'll ask for a proposal from either Stave, and who'll, you know, if it's one of his freebies, or we can use RJ. 1282 02:43:20.880 --> 02:43:33.150 Kriss Grisham: But cost-wise, too, if you take a look at, like, worst-case scenarios from the numbers that are in the report, you're looking at $2,500 to $3,000 per culvert, and… 1283 02:43:33.150 --> 02:43:42.400 Kriss Grisham: And once it's in, it's in, you know? So, it's unlike a bridge, where you have a lot of wood, and… and… 1284 02:43:42.620 --> 02:43:47.259 Kriss Grisham: Erosion, potentially, you know, and you gotta go back, inspect it, replace the wood. 1285 02:43:47.570 --> 02:43:58.650 Kriss Grisham: culverts that I've seen in the woods, and that's what Patty's saying, too, some of them are metal, and they need to be replaced because they just rotted out, and that's been years. 1286 02:43:59.220 --> 02:44:03.739 Kriss Grisham: And so that's one of the reasons that we wanted the Council to, to, 1287 02:44:03.770 --> 02:44:23.150 Kriss Grisham: look at this report and endorse the direction that we wanted to go in for safety on the trails. And it's, you know, to stay clear of bridges, there's just too much design work and maintenance activities, and go with culverts. And then if you… and it's also cheaper. If you take a look at 1288 02:44:23.510 --> 02:44:28.140 Kriss Grisham: the materials needed to do a convert, you know? Pipe, riprap. 1289 02:44:28.820 --> 02:44:33.159 Kriss Grisham: And some soil, compact it, and hopefully that's it. 1290 02:44:36.140 --> 02:44:43.289 John Compton: Okay, further discussion on, approval of the report and recommendation… recommendations there. 1291 02:44:44.340 --> 02:44:53.229 John Compton: If not, all in favor of approving the report and their recommendations, I see 5 unanimous. Okay, guys, good work. 1292 02:44:53.980 --> 02:44:55.630 Kathy Lehman: Who was the second, please? 1293 02:44:57.680 --> 02:44:58.259 John Compton: I don't know. 1294 02:44:58.260 --> 02:45:00.240 Peter Nagrod: It was me, I seconded it. 1295 02:45:00.490 --> 02:45:01.240 Kathy Lehman: Thank you. 1296 02:45:02.480 --> 02:45:03.939 John Compton: Okay, excellent. 1297 02:45:04.680 --> 02:45:10.059 John Compton: Alright, the next item will be quick, it's, the… 1298 02:45:10.470 --> 02:45:13.280 John Compton: The hiring of the next town clerk. 1299 02:45:13.280 --> 02:45:16.309 Peter Nagrod: So, I'm gonna let Barbara… 1300 02:45:17.000 --> 02:45:22.420 John Compton: do this, go ahead, if you will, or I will, I mean, it's, you know… 1301 02:45:22.420 --> 02:45:29.960 Barbara: Sure, I'll be happy to do it. So, the current draft is in the, 1302 02:45:29.960 --> 02:45:54.480 Barbara: the dropbox that John shared earlier. We've been really going through, what has been typically the responsibilities of the town clerk, and what are, like, the aspirational, Peter talked about knowledge management. We want somebody who's, able to post things to the website and handle things like that. 1303 02:45:54.640 --> 02:46:17.119 Barbara: take on a little bit of responsibility… more responsibility than we typically have expected of our town clerk. And also, Eva made a really good point about the management of facilities. So, it wasn't in the materials that John shared, but I had made some suggestions about, what that language would look like. 1304 02:46:17.250 --> 02:46:22.419 Barbara: Because I really do believe we need somebody to be a little more… 1305 02:46:22.420 --> 02:46:41.599 Barbara: Like, above the volunteers, and have knowledge that the volunteers don't have. So, one of the things that I would like to see is a section on town operations, managing town facilities and programs, ensuring town compliance with state and county regulations, because those are really important things that 1306 02:46:41.600 --> 02:46:44.700 Barbara: As we've seen, sometimes fall through the cracks. 1307 02:46:44.700 --> 02:46:59.039 Barbara: So, we're still working on that, we still have another meeting. Hopefully, we'll finalize that description soon, and we're also talking about where to post it. I feel like we should really target, like, the international 1308 02:46:59.040 --> 02:47:13.799 Barbara: what is it called? ICMA, International City Managers Association, and there's the National Association of Counties, because that's where we would find people with the skills that we're really looking for. We also talked about local places to advertise 1309 02:47:13.800 --> 02:47:20.199 Barbara: Patch, which is sort of like a local online newspaper, and things like that. So, 1310 02:47:20.660 --> 02:47:25.490 Barbara: So, I don't know, that's… that's pretty much my summary of it. 1311 02:47:27.430 --> 02:47:40.140 Peter Nagrod: Do you want to say anything about… because I know a lot… there's this movement to have a city… to have a manager, a town manager, or whatever, and how we were kind of looking at elevating this position into. 1312 02:47:40.140 --> 02:47:40.730 Barbara: Yeah. 1313 02:47:40.730 --> 02:47:44.039 Peter Nagrod: Not that, but, you know, we're thinking in terms of that, right? 1314 02:47:44.040 --> 02:47:55.589 Barbara: Yeah, I mean, I would be perfectly content with calling this position town manager, because a lot of the responsibilities that we're talking about are more of a manager than a client. 1315 02:47:55.590 --> 02:47:56.180 Peter Nagrod: Right. 1316 02:47:56.670 --> 02:48:00.160 Barbara: So I would be very comfortable with doing that. 1317 02:48:00.160 --> 02:48:00.780 Peter Nagrod: Yeah. 1318 02:48:04.000 --> 02:48:04.610 John Compton: So… 1319 02:48:04.860 --> 02:48:14.299 John Compton: Okay, so, as Barbara said, the group who's put this together, that's me, Jean, Peter, Barbara, and Mary. 1320 02:48:14.420 --> 02:48:17.249 John Compton: We'll have one more, 1321 02:48:17.620 --> 02:48:27.100 John Compton: shot at, you know, at adding some of the things Barbara mentioned, and, I'm considering, wow. 1322 02:48:27.260 --> 02:48:41.280 John Compton: what we want to call the position. I think, since we're having a meeting on March 23rd on the budget, that it would be appropriate for the Council to simply, rubber stamp the job description 1323 02:48:41.280 --> 02:48:53.200 John Compton: and intentions. Obviously, we have to have a budget to go along with this position, which is part of the, the recommendation, so we'll… we can deal with that, on the 23rd. 1324 02:48:58.050 --> 02:49:02.679 John Compton: Alright, I, I, you know, as, as for myself, 1325 02:49:02.870 --> 02:49:07.410 John Compton: I have a… my concept of a town manager… 1326 02:49:08.610 --> 02:49:13.499 John Compton: I'll back up. We got one town manager job description. 1327 02:49:13.950 --> 02:49:17.810 John Compton: I think we could get a few more if we wanted. They all… 1328 02:49:19.190 --> 02:49:34.530 John Compton: roll-in functions of… of the treasurer, some of our vendors. The town manager descriptions look like a… look like a job description for two and a half people, yet they're one person. 1329 02:49:34.870 --> 02:49:41.020 John Compton: So, I'm… my… my… I'm a little bit leery of… 1330 02:49:42.700 --> 02:49:48.489 John Compton: what are… what… what other town manager positions seem to encompass. 1331 02:49:49.450 --> 02:49:53.220 John Compton: As opposed to what Washington Grove needs. 1332 02:49:53.350 --> 02:49:54.020 Peter Nagrod: Right. 1333 02:49:54.230 --> 02:50:04.599 John Compton: I'm gonna just make a comment, because I'm thinking of it right now. The question of meeting state standards, operational standards, and requirements. 1334 02:50:04.600 --> 02:50:18.029 John Compton: If you guys don't know, Jean Moyer, our treasurer, has really, been working, you know, I would say a third of her time, maybe more. 1335 02:50:18.200 --> 02:50:26.619 John Compton: On, on, hR-related, so I'll call it HR-related, personnel-related stuff. 1336 02:50:26.950 --> 02:50:34.680 John Compton: A lot of it is to make it easier for the treasurer's life to, you know, with all the part-timers we hire. 1337 02:50:34.780 --> 02:50:44.239 John Compton: But a lot of it is to improve our procedures and our descriptions and what have you. She also works with Legit, so I would… 1338 02:50:44.650 --> 02:50:51.540 John Compton: Tentatively suggest that that responsibility that was called out. 1339 02:50:52.350 --> 02:50:56.280 John Compton: would be, part of the treasurer's 1340 02:50:57.570 --> 02:51:07.669 John Compton: job. The reason for it not to be part of the clerk's job is that the clerk's job is guy… when you see… if you've looked at the description. 1341 02:51:07.890 --> 02:51:15.669 John Compton: and heard everybody's wish list. It has become a… I think an overwhelming 1342 02:51:16.300 --> 02:51:21.250 John Compton: responsibility. I may be wrong, maybe it's just my… 1343 02:51:21.250 --> 02:51:22.510 Kathy Lehman: No, you're right. 1344 02:51:22.960 --> 02:51:30.039 John Compton: So I'm… I would be looking for ways to, you know, reduce that responsibility. 1345 02:51:30.380 --> 02:51:33.759 John Compton: We're going to get, in a moment, to the website. 1346 02:51:34.870 --> 02:51:49.709 John Compton: guess what? Guess who's… who could be responsible for the website? So that's what I mean. So, anyway, we'll leave that for March… for the next meeting in two weeks, to finalize it. So the goal is to finalize the job description. 1347 02:51:50.340 --> 02:51:54.020 John Compton: I'd get it out so that we can… Go start the hiring process. 1348 02:51:55.430 --> 02:51:56.760 John Compton: Everybody good with that? 1349 02:51:58.220 --> 02:52:05.270 John Compton: Okay, so we are now on to the replacement of the town webmaster and the town bulletin Producer. 1350 02:52:05.520 --> 02:52:09.259 John Compton: I'm calling you the producer, that's a terabyte, that must be a better way. 1351 02:52:09.640 --> 02:52:10.529 John Compton: Say that. 1352 02:52:10.740 --> 02:52:18.489 John Compton: Where we are right now, Arlene McCrean has, definitely committed to, 1353 02:52:18.500 --> 02:52:32.980 John Compton: turning the bulletin into the MailChimp HTML format that we've been getting these past months via Christine. Arlene did it once when Christine was out of town. She's certainly going to be able to do that. That's fantastic. 1354 02:52:33.580 --> 02:52:43.200 John Compton: The other function of, the other functions that we're looking for that we need to replace, because Christine has been handling all of them. 1355 02:52:43.370 --> 02:52:50.010 John Compton: Are, maintaining the information content of the website. 1356 02:52:50.530 --> 02:52:59.520 John Compton: And, improving, the functionality of the website, with respect to a number of, of things. 1357 02:52:59.650 --> 02:53:06.740 John Compton: And Arlene has also, agreed to, Give a shot. 1358 02:53:07.350 --> 02:53:09.560 John Compton: Pending how much time it will take. 1359 02:53:09.830 --> 02:53:18.200 John Compton: To, sort of be the, the project, manager for website, improvements. 1360 02:53:18.770 --> 02:53:36.209 John Compton: So she's quite knowledgeable in that area, and I believe will be very capable, so the actual, the actual, functionality will be done by a developer. So, there is currently funds in the budget for a developer, and the idea would be to continue that. 1361 02:53:36.520 --> 02:53:45.160 John Compton: So, and the last… the idea of keeping the information content current, That we are… 1362 02:53:45.470 --> 02:53:51.170 John Compton: We have, placed in, in a, responsibility for the new clerk. 1363 02:53:52.620 --> 02:54:02.209 John Compton: So there's some requirements there. There are two ways to deal with that. One is if the… if the new town clerk is… is… 1364 02:54:02.210 --> 02:54:15.649 John Compton: is very competent and able with respect to, some, you know, some… this information content on a website. They could do it themselves. Alternatively. 1365 02:54:15.970 --> 02:54:30.270 John Compton: We could hire a web outfit or a web individual who would make those information updates, and the town clerk would be responsible for providing. 1366 02:54:30.580 --> 02:54:31.350 John Compton: the… 1367 02:54:31.500 --> 02:54:43.140 John Compton: That's not going to absolve all the committee chairmen and everything else. Everybody else for creating the content, but the clerk would then be responsible for executing it using a contract. 1368 02:54:43.660 --> 02:54:47.079 John Compton: That's the current thinking, that's all I wanted to say about that. 1369 02:54:47.500 --> 02:54:48.110 Peter Nagrod: Okay. 1370 02:54:51.770 --> 02:54:59.840 John Compton: All right, so, we've, deferred the proposal to purchase playground equipment till the 23rd. 1371 02:55:00.030 --> 02:55:08.429 John Compton: So the last item before the Council reports is, a resolution, which drafts 1372 02:55:08.830 --> 02:55:16.260 John Compton: multiple, I think, were placed in the information on the… Oh. 1373 02:55:16.430 --> 02:55:17.789 John Compton: In the Dropbox. 1374 02:55:18.160 --> 02:55:20.950 John Compton: And, 1375 02:55:22.590 --> 02:55:32.529 John Compton: I sent out earlier a draft, for comments. I did get some comments and suggestions for, from Barbara. 1376 02:55:32.870 --> 02:55:35.820 John Compton: Which… Made. 1377 02:55:36.940 --> 02:55:39.970 John Compton: I felt material alterations. 1378 02:55:40.720 --> 02:55:43.889 John Compton: Material, not in the sense that it… 1379 02:55:44.080 --> 02:55:53.709 John Compton: it invalidated the resolution, but it just, it just, you know, had a different, a different, emphasis. 1380 02:55:54.170 --> 02:55:59.860 John Compton: So, we're going nowhere with this without a motion to approve. 1381 02:56:01.240 --> 02:56:12.930 John Compton: nominally a motion to introduce this resolution, after which we can discuss it, so I didn't arrange for anybody to 1382 02:56:13.190 --> 02:56:17.170 John Compton: move to introduce, unless Barbara is willing to do it. 1383 02:56:18.760 --> 02:56:20.759 Barbara: I'm a little lost about… 1384 02:56:21.270 --> 02:56:35.129 Barbara: there's Larry's version, there's my version, and there's your version. So, I will move to approve the version that I wrote. I didn't write. I amended Larry's 1385 02:56:35.330 --> 02:56:44.189 Barbara: version, and I basically changed the title to the title that you prefer John? 1386 02:56:44.410 --> 02:56:56.599 Barbara: And Larry's original version had the town, standing by this statement, and I changed it to the mayor and town council. I added a couple of other little words. 1387 02:56:56.770 --> 02:57:07.269 Barbara: And then I added at the end, just, you know, a test and approved by the Mayor and town council. I did not change anything substantively, I just made some minor changes in the language. 1388 02:57:09.920 --> 02:57:12.959 Barbara: So I move that this version be accepted. 1389 02:57:16.310 --> 02:57:18.239 John Compton: Do I need a second, man? 1390 02:57:19.320 --> 02:57:20.760 Peter Nagrod: I'll second it, Peter. 1391 02:57:20.760 --> 02:57:23.450 Kathy Lehman: And isn't it a motion to introduce? 1392 02:57:25.160 --> 02:57:25.830 John Compton: Well… 1393 02:57:26.070 --> 02:57:28.490 Kathy Lehman: Gotcha, okay, I'm just making… 1394 02:57:29.350 --> 02:57:29.910 John Compton: Oh. 1395 02:57:31.990 --> 02:57:40.450 John Compton: Okay, so, introduced is, we don't need a vote. It is introduced when you have a motion and a second. 1396 02:57:40.450 --> 02:57:43.520 Barbara: But my motion was to approve this version. 1397 02:57:43.760 --> 02:57:44.500 John Compton: Okay, here's… 1398 02:57:44.500 --> 02:57:44.930 Barbara: motion. 1399 02:57:44.930 --> 02:57:50.759 John Compton: You're… you're simply asking for approval. Okay, so the motion is to approve this version. 1400 02:57:52.130 --> 02:57:54.350 John Compton: Discussion. 1401 02:58:05.290 --> 02:58:06.310 John Compton: discussion. 1402 02:58:07.440 --> 02:58:08.739 Kathy Lehman: People are tired. 1403 02:58:08.740 --> 02:58:15.560 John Compton: All right, I… well, they are tired, so my… I amended the, the agenda to indicate 1404 02:58:15.740 --> 02:58:25.969 John Compton: A suggestion that, I, I had the same thought, Barbara also mentioned it in an email, that, 1405 02:58:26.150 --> 02:58:32.390 John Compton: because I'm not going to make… I mean, I'm not going to belabor it at this late hour. I do think 1406 02:58:32.500 --> 02:58:44.710 John Compton: the version that I promoted Includes something that this version omits, and that is some statements about the 1407 02:58:44.810 --> 02:58:48.100 John Compton: The civil rights of, 1408 02:58:48.200 --> 02:58:53.300 John Compton: individuals in the United States, and how, how, 1409 02:58:53.710 --> 02:58:57.350 John Compton: That's… that's what needs to be recognized. 1410 02:58:57.510 --> 02:59:00.110 John Compton: By the federal government. 1411 02:59:00.950 --> 02:59:05.580 John Compton: And this… This and Larry's version did not 1412 02:59:05.720 --> 02:59:12.669 John Compton: specifically call that out, and I believe that that's the strongest thing we can actually say. 1413 02:59:12.900 --> 02:59:17.910 John Compton: I mean, it's all fine to say, you know, don't do all these illegal things. 1414 02:59:18.190 --> 02:59:19.980 John Compton: They're all abhorrent. 1415 02:59:20.290 --> 02:59:26.030 John Compton: But what's really going on is a violation of civil rights. 1416 02:59:26.180 --> 02:59:30.730 John Compton: And that, I find to be… top level. 1417 02:59:30.850 --> 02:59:44.010 John Compton: Unconstitutional, un-American, I could go on and on thing that's going on. So, sorry about this. 1418 02:59:45.600 --> 02:59:54.479 John Compton: Anyway, so my opinion… that's just my opinion at this point. So the suggestion at this late hour, unless people want to just move to a vote on this, which is… 1419 02:59:54.620 --> 03:00:05.700 John Compton: Our prerogative, is that we, we, name a group, a subset of the council, to, take a look. 1420 03:00:05.820 --> 03:00:08.450 John Compton: Kind of discuss this and come back. 1421 03:00:08.580 --> 03:00:12.320 John Compton: With a, with their recommendation, 1422 03:00:12.500 --> 03:00:17.960 John Compton: And, and then act on… Taking an action. 1423 03:00:17.960 --> 03:00:22.630 johnporter: Yeah, I would appreciate that, because I really didn't know there were 3 different versions. I thought they were wrong. 1424 03:00:22.630 --> 03:00:23.340 Peter Nagrod: Yeah. 1425 03:00:24.230 --> 03:00:29.120 johnporter: different versions… I just thought they were amendments, one after the other, so I just read the latest one. 1426 03:00:31.000 --> 03:00:33.229 Barbara: They are amendments. They are amendments. 1427 03:00:33.230 --> 03:00:33.850 Peter Nagrod: What's it? 1428 03:00:33.850 --> 03:00:40.200 Barbara: Larry's original, then John's amendments, and my amendments. So there's 3 versions. 1429 03:00:40.230 --> 03:00:47.659 Peter Nagrod: My only concern would be timeliness, is, like, another month, because… This is… this is… 1430 03:00:47.810 --> 03:01:05.459 Peter Nagrod: I mean, nobody's gonna read this so closely that, you know, it's just really us just supporting something. And if you all think that it's fine to wait another month, and not, you know, weigh in, I'm fine with that, but it seems like we should really get moving on it. 1431 03:01:09.210 --> 03:01:12.849 John Compton: Well, I think it's important to say the right things. 1432 03:01:12.850 --> 03:01:13.260 Peter Nagrod: Yeah. 1433 03:01:13.260 --> 03:01:23.119 John Compton: My version includes… The, the, the direction to deliver it to our senators. 1434 03:01:23.260 --> 03:01:26.319 John Compton: And the president, it said… I don't know if the president understood that. 1435 03:01:27.180 --> 03:01:34.790 Mary W: Barbara, would you… would you have a, the objection to adopting John's version instead of your version as the one we… 1436 03:01:34.790 --> 03:01:49.560 Barbara: Yeah, I do object to it, because I think it's un… it's… it makes it much longer. The whole idea of sending it to the senators, that's included in… in the document, which… we don't have to say who… we can send it to whoever we want. 1437 03:01:49.560 --> 03:01:49.940 Peter Nagrod: ads. 1438 03:01:49.940 --> 03:01:59.549 Barbara: much longer. I think we should try to stick to one page if possible. This goes… you know, we're sending it to a senator. Who reads it? His staff. 1439 03:01:59.550 --> 03:02:23.879 Barbara: They get hundreds of messages every day. They don't need, you know, two pages of us saying every single thing we think about this. It's enough that we make, you know, strong points, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, and then move on. So, I think that we should just do it. We could wordsmith it for the coming month, and then next month come back and wordsmith it some more. 1440 03:02:23.880 --> 03:02:26.169 Barbara: But I just don't think that's necessary. 1441 03:02:32.560 --> 03:02:33.230 Peter Nagrod: Okay. 1442 03:02:35.240 --> 03:02:37.300 Peter Nagrod: So we're gonna defer this, right, John? 1443 03:02:37.300 --> 03:02:42.730 John Compton: So, so John Porter has, asked for, for, at least a deferral. 1444 03:02:43.270 --> 03:02:47.369 John Compton: I've suggested that we… You know, maybe a few… 1445 03:02:47.950 --> 03:02:53.120 John Compton: Council members, and myself discuss whether, you know. 1446 03:02:53.260 --> 03:03:02.260 John Compton: you know, what to bring back. We're going to bring back this one, but whether or not any amendments should be suggested to this… 1447 03:03:02.970 --> 03:03:03.990 John Compton: version. 1448 03:03:04.280 --> 03:03:09.630 Barbara: So, are these amendments to my motion, or what are they? 1449 03:03:09.630 --> 03:03:11.060 John Compton: It's a deferral. 1450 03:03:11.580 --> 03:03:15.589 Barbara: Okay, so that would have to be moved and seconded. 1451 03:03:15.590 --> 03:03:16.439 John Compton: That's correct. 1452 03:03:17.010 --> 03:03:19.189 John Compton: It was my suggestion, I can't… 1453 03:03:19.600 --> 03:03:26.600 John Compton: I can't move that this be deferred to a… another time. 1454 03:03:26.800 --> 03:03:29.040 Mary W: John, did you move to defer it, since you. 1455 03:03:29.040 --> 03:03:30.670 John Compton: I can't. John. 1456 03:03:30.670 --> 03:03:31.789 Mary W: the other John. 1457 03:03:31.790 --> 03:03:34.580 johnporter: No, I didn't. I just was… I just had comments. 1458 03:03:34.580 --> 03:03:36.309 Peter Nagrod: Hint, hint, hint. 1459 03:03:39.080 --> 03:03:41.980 johnporter: to make a motion to defer this action until… 1460 03:03:42.590 --> 03:03:44.200 Mary W: So we can go home. 1461 03:03:44.200 --> 03:03:44.590 Peter Nagrod: Yes, sir. 1462 03:03:44.590 --> 03:03:55.150 johnporter: Okay, let's, let's, let's… Not yet. I'll put together a motion to defer action until we can have a group that works on editing these documents into a single document. 1463 03:03:55.730 --> 03:03:56.939 Kriss Grisham: I'll second. 1464 03:03:58.070 --> 03:03:58.920 Peter Nagrod: Okay. 1465 03:03:59.330 --> 03:04:03.649 Barbara: So what is the process for putting together the group, John? 1466 03:04:04.330 --> 03:04:05.800 John Compton: Well, since I believe… 1467 03:04:05.800 --> 03:04:08.109 Barbara: John Porter, since he made the motion. 1468 03:04:11.930 --> 03:04:15.500 Barbara: I mean, it's a very vague motion. Let's put together a group. 1469 03:04:15.890 --> 03:04:18.610 Barbara: But I think it needs to be clear. 1470 03:04:22.750 --> 03:04:23.690 John Compton: Watch some help? 1471 03:04:24.470 --> 03:04:26.760 johnporter: A group of volunteer counselors? 1472 03:04:28.960 --> 03:04:31.189 Kriss Grisham: Or do you want other people from the town involved? 1473 03:04:32.770 --> 03:04:34.349 Peter Nagrod: Yeah, well, let's just take forever. 1474 03:04:34.350 --> 03:04:37.750 John Compton: This will have to come from the council, so I think… 1475 03:04:38.020 --> 03:04:40.850 John Compton: Unless you just want some other opinions, which… 1476 03:04:42.650 --> 03:04:44.109 johnporter: I'm sure we can get. 1477 03:04:49.070 --> 03:05:00.330 Peter Nagrod: So, John, I would like to see John, Barbara, and maybe you'd want to have, since Larry did the original version, Larry, the three of you, can work it out. 1478 03:05:02.270 --> 03:05:03.120 johnporter: Okay. 1479 03:05:03.120 --> 03:05:09.140 John Compton: Okay, Barbara and I have already been back and forth, about her 1480 03:05:11.020 --> 03:05:17.299 John Compton: Never are the points she just made in favor of what's before the Council. 1481 03:05:17.550 --> 03:05:20.600 John Compton: To me, the length is irrelevant. 1482 03:05:20.880 --> 03:05:36.530 John Compton: I think it's extremely vital that it specify that it is intended for the government of the United States. We can certainly send it to anybody we want, but the intention is that the message goes to those who are responsible 1483 03:05:36.530 --> 03:05:41.900 John Compton: for changing this policy. Otherwise, it's just griping, in my opinion. 1484 03:05:41.990 --> 03:05:44.909 Peter Nagrod: But you're… you're… you're arguing with us, we don't care. 1485 03:05:44.910 --> 03:05:45.990 John Compton: I don't… I'm just… 1486 03:05:45.990 --> 03:05:47.150 Peter Nagrod: Barbara is, you said… 1487 03:05:47.150 --> 03:05:51.580 John Compton: only saying that, you know, Barbara and I are probably going to continue to. 1488 03:05:51.580 --> 03:05:52.100 Peter Nagrod: Oh. 1489 03:05:52.100 --> 03:05:58.899 John Compton: got that. So, if you put us together, you know, we need some… some other opinions. 1490 03:05:58.900 --> 03:05:59.539 Peter Nagrod: I think the person. 1491 03:05:59.540 --> 03:06:02.369 John Compton: IRA, I'm sure, would be happy to lend his… 1492 03:06:02.370 --> 03:06:07.199 johnporter: I, you know, I'm not sure you want… I have this… I have probably the least opinions of anybody out there. 1493 03:06:07.200 --> 03:06:08.229 Peter Nagrod: Yeah, you're perfect! 1494 03:06:08.230 --> 03:06:15.819 johnporter: All I said was I didn't know there were 3 distinct versions. I thought they were all versions of the same document, so… 1495 03:06:15.930 --> 03:06:16.500 Peter Nagrod: Yeah. 1496 03:06:16.500 --> 03:06:18.180 Barbara: They are! They are! 1497 03:06:18.180 --> 03:06:18.550 Peter Nagrod: No. 1498 03:06:18.550 --> 03:06:29.060 Barbara: It started with Barry French's document, and then John made a series of edits to it, and I made several edits to it separately, so that's how it ended up being finished. 1499 03:06:29.060 --> 03:06:30.180 johnporter: Yeah, I'm noticing I didn't. 1500 03:06:30.180 --> 03:06:35.350 Barbara: The main document is intact. Or, well, sort of. 1501 03:06:35.870 --> 03:06:39.640 John Compton: Yeah, we didn't delete much out of Larry's, neither. 1502 03:06:39.640 --> 03:06:40.380 johnporter: Okay. 1503 03:06:42.510 --> 03:06:47.650 John Compton: It's… it was whether we had anything. Okay, so I… fine. The motion… 1504 03:06:47.650 --> 03:06:52.560 johnporter: You know, I could rescind that motion, just say, let's just vote on this, you know? 1505 03:06:52.560 --> 03:07:05.029 John Compton: The motion I hear is you named me, and Barbara, and Larry, and it would be helpful to have one other council member who has nothing to do, and that's not Chris. 1506 03:07:06.040 --> 03:07:13.649 John Compton: Mary, or… or John, you know, somebody who, you know. 1507 03:07:14.260 --> 03:07:15.210 Mary W: I'll help. 1508 03:07:15.820 --> 03:07:22.660 John Compton: Thank you, Mary. Okay, there you go. So we've got three councilmen, two council members, me and Larry. 1509 03:07:23.470 --> 03:07:24.600 John Compton: In the motion, right? 1510 03:07:24.830 --> 03:07:25.710 Peter Nagrod: Okay. 1511 03:07:26.030 --> 03:07:26.720 johnporter: Okay. 1512 03:07:28.860 --> 03:07:32.379 John Compton: I think everybody understands the motion. All in favor of… 1513 03:07:32.380 --> 03:07:34.970 Barbara: Is there a second to that motion? 1514 03:07:34.970 --> 03:07:36.110 John Compton: Yes, Chris? 1515 03:07:36.930 --> 03:07:38.440 johnporter: He seconded. 1516 03:07:39.600 --> 03:07:40.220 Peter Nagrod: Okay. 1517 03:07:40.220 --> 03:07:45.610 John Compton: Okay, the motion to deferral takes precedence all in favor of the deferral, as stated. 1518 03:07:45.610 --> 03:07:46.290 Peter Nagrod: Hmm. 1519 03:07:46.290 --> 03:07:49.850 John Compton: She… I see 4, Barbara, no. 1520 03:07:49.850 --> 03:07:50.580 Barbara: So… 1521 03:07:50.580 --> 03:07:55.970 John Compton: Okay, so that's 4-1. Okay, deferred, we'll… we'll, 1522 03:07:56.680 --> 03:08:12.360 John Compton: take care of this. If we're quick, we can again do it by March 23rd. I hope we have time for the fiscal 27 budget, but, or we can… it could go to April. I, I didn't make a comment on the, on the, on the, on the, 1523 03:08:13.710 --> 03:08:33.379 John Compton: you know, how quickly this should be. Unfortunately, I don't see any sign that these activities are going away anytime soon. If we had a functional Congress, that might happen, so I think it's still going to be just as timely in April as it is today. 1524 03:08:33.380 --> 03:08:34.420 Peter Nagrod: Okay, good. 1525 03:08:34.830 --> 03:08:36.070 johnporter: That's just my… 1526 03:08:37.770 --> 03:08:39.420 John Compton: Things are changing. Alright, good. 1527 03:08:39.590 --> 03:08:45.190 John Compton: So, so we're moving right along, to the Town Council reports. I have a. 1528 03:08:45.190 --> 03:08:46.130 Oscar Ramos: John. 1529 03:08:46.410 --> 03:08:58.059 Oscar Ramos: Sorry, sorry to cut in. I have a question about the playground. We thought we weren't going to present tonight, and then we were put back on the agenda, and then we skipped, and we're still here, and… 1530 03:08:58.730 --> 03:09:04.290 John Compton: Oh, that's because the… oh, it was the issue of… I think Peter raised… 1531 03:09:05.600 --> 03:09:07.800 John Compton: Of spending this year's money, right? 1532 03:09:07.800 --> 03:09:12.719 Peter Nagrod: Right, and I was gonna say, because I've been getting text messages that… 1533 03:09:12.910 --> 03:09:22.220 Peter Nagrod: there was a question… no, it was a question of whether the playground equipment, the train, needs to go through the RFP process or not. 1534 03:09:22.710 --> 03:09:38.720 Peter Nagrod: Which is crucial that we know that, and I would… if you're okay with this, I would make the motion that, based on our understanding of the uniqueness of what they want to get, that we do not go through the RFP process for this purchase. 1535 03:09:39.550 --> 03:09:40.869 Peter Nagrod: Can I do that? 1536 03:09:40.870 --> 03:09:41.440 John Compton: Yeah. 1537 03:09:41.480 --> 03:09:42.450 Peter Nagrod: Okay, I'll start it. 1538 03:09:42.450 --> 03:09:42.820 Mary W: it. 1539 03:09:43.230 --> 03:09:43.700 Peter Nagrod: Okay. 1540 03:09:43.700 --> 03:09:47.290 John Compton: recommendation. I don't see how this can be competitively bid. 1541 03:09:47.290 --> 03:09:51.970 Peter Nagrod: Good, okay, yeah, okay, I'm not gonna say anything. I just… motioned, okay. 1542 03:09:51.970 --> 03:09:53.789 Mary W: This is Mary, I second that. 1543 03:09:54.100 --> 03:09:54.690 John Compton: Okay. 1544 03:09:55.480 --> 03:09:58.199 John Compton: Any discussion on… on that? Just… 1545 03:09:58.950 --> 03:09:59.570 Kriss Grisham: Quote. 1546 03:09:59.570 --> 03:10:01.530 Peter Nagrod: So I… yeah. 1547 03:10:01.530 --> 03:10:03.089 Kriss Grisham: Just a quick comment. 1548 03:10:04.070 --> 03:10:06.770 Kriss Grisham: you know, without an RFP, 1549 03:10:07.380 --> 03:10:10.639 Kriss Grisham: I guess the concern that I have, and… 1550 03:10:13.910 --> 03:10:17.159 Kriss Grisham: try to make this quick. 1551 03:10:21.550 --> 03:10:26.310 Kriss Grisham: We need to have something that kind of fits in line with what might 1552 03:10:26.980 --> 03:10:33.970 Kriss Grisham: be addressed in an RFP. You know, playground equipment, specific needs, wants. 1553 03:10:34.270 --> 03:10:43.879 Kriss Grisham: And, you know, the different types of materials, I guess, that we might be looking at. So, if we do go to more than one vendor. 1554 03:10:44.140 --> 03:10:48.939 Kriss Grisham: That makes this equipment, whatever it might be. 1555 03:10:50.170 --> 03:10:56.509 Kriss Grisham: You know, you want to be able to evaluate what comes in, apples to apples, and not apples to oranges. 1556 03:10:57.170 --> 03:11:01.370 Kriss Grisham: with, I'm assuming we're going out with more than one 1557 03:11:01.840 --> 03:11:05.950 Kriss Grisham: Request, because we're supposed to, in accordance with 1558 03:11:06.360 --> 03:11:09.160 Kriss Grisham: You know, the town charter, 1559 03:11:10.490 --> 03:11:12.810 Kriss Grisham: Unless we're trying to bypass that. Would the… 1560 03:11:12.810 --> 03:11:14.499 Oscar Ramos: No, we'll come back with, like. 1561 03:11:14.500 --> 03:11:14.850 John Compton: One more time. 1562 03:11:14.850 --> 03:11:15.879 Oscar Ramos: Three, at least. 1563 03:11:16.210 --> 03:11:18.950 Kriss Grisham: We're… we're coming back… yeah, okay, okay. 1564 03:11:19.510 --> 03:11:26.190 Kriss Grisham: And then, so, with that said, when you come back with that, Bid sheet, or, or… 1565 03:11:26.510 --> 03:11:45.119 Kriss Grisham: proposal, you know, we want to be able to look at that as apples to apples as much as we can to determine the cost. And so, if we're not doing an RFP, and I'm not saying we need one, we need some kind of a sheet of paper that describes what it is that we're looking for so that they know what to target, whoever the bidders are. 1566 03:11:45.120 --> 03:11:45.750 Peter Nagrod: Right. 1567 03:11:47.360 --> 03:11:51.820 John Compton: So Chris makes a good point. You know, there are fact… you know, there's… 1568 03:11:52.680 --> 03:11:55.509 John Compton: There, there's your, there's your criteria. 1569 03:11:55.820 --> 03:11:58.259 John Compton: For the… for the equipment. 1570 03:11:58.690 --> 03:12:09.339 John Compton: And, you know, you start at the top with the, the comprehensive plan for the playground, recommends X. So we're going to look at that. 1571 03:12:09.400 --> 03:12:13.560 John Compton: And what are the issues with that? It's what is it made out of? 1572 03:12:13.580 --> 03:12:31.299 John Compton: Any other things serviced by the… by the… by the vendor, this, that, and the other thing. So… so, Oscar, you know, you just make a list, it's pretty obvious. And usually when you start to… if you have two who produce… both have, let's say, train… 1573 03:12:32.220 --> 03:12:40.800 John Compton: you know, equipment available. You know, you want to, have things that, compare the two. 1574 03:12:41.510 --> 03:12:45.710 John Compton: You know, so you can get answers to questions. You know what we're talking about. 1575 03:12:45.710 --> 03:12:48.570 Oscar Ramos: Good presentation, we'll outline all that. 1576 03:12:49.900 --> 03:12:58.319 John Compton: And so Chris was just reminding you that… that if you… if we're not gonna… if we're not gonna write out a scope of work for an RFP, which is the main thing, the RFP, 1577 03:12:59.830 --> 03:13:05.940 John Compton: does, that we still need to have, a, you know, comparable. 1578 03:13:06.230 --> 03:13:08.600 John Compton: Comparable vendor proposals. 1579 03:13:09.080 --> 03:13:21.480 Kriss Grisham: Okay. You know, and along those lines, too, I guess, you know, and Oscar, you and I, we talked about this, and it's no… nothing new, you know, it's just whatever material that this is made out of is, you know, hopefully the… 1580 03:13:21.480 --> 03:13:34.859 Kriss Grisham: the new equipment would give us, you know, the periodic maintenance requirements, the long-term maintenance requirements, you know, that type of thing. And we just need to be able to cost that out and compare them, you know, from the bidders that you get. 1581 03:13:34.860 --> 03:13:40.830 John Compton: It's not a preference of wood over plastic, it's what are the maintenance 1582 03:13:41.040 --> 03:13:52.219 John Compton: characteristics, because we can decide whether we want… if we want to do more, accept something that we like better, even though it has more maintenance, fine, we can make that decision. 1583 03:13:52.820 --> 03:13:58.149 John Compton: We just need to know about it. The critical things need to be available to evaluate. 1584 03:14:00.150 --> 03:14:03.359 John Compton: All right, it's always good. We, once again. 1585 03:14:03.570 --> 03:14:11.649 John Compton: This would be a good thing to write up, because, you know, there are a variety of circumstances where this is the better approach. 1586 03:14:11.790 --> 03:14:14.489 John Compton: than, the RSPFR. 1587 03:14:15.470 --> 03:14:19.019 Kathy Lehman: Because we still want to be fiscally responsible, you know. 1588 03:14:19.060 --> 03:14:26.199 John Compton: At the very least, we want to get what we want, and at best, we want to get what we want at the best price. 1589 03:14:29.050 --> 03:14:33.900 Peter Nagrod: I'm gonna be… I'm gonna be Barbara right now and say there's a motion on the table. 1590 03:14:35.250 --> 03:14:38.410 Peter Nagrod: So, can we go with it? All in favor of… 1591 03:14:38.410 --> 03:14:40.489 Barbara: Can you repeat the motion? 1592 03:14:40.490 --> 03:14:47.800 John Compton: The motion is to, not use the RFP process, but go out to the… out to vendors with our specific 1593 03:14:48.160 --> 03:14:50.830 John Compton: For a specific proposal for this. 1594 03:14:54.900 --> 03:14:55.780 Peter Nagrod: I know. 1595 03:14:56.110 --> 03:15:03.490 Barbara: I'm lost with this. I'm looking at the materials for tonight, I don't see anything. 1596 03:15:03.490 --> 03:15:07.900 John Compton: No, you don't. You will hear all about it. 1597 03:15:08.110 --> 03:15:10.399 John Compton: It was the interest of time. You'll hear all about. 1598 03:15:10.400 --> 03:15:14.630 Barbara: Right, and I saw that Oscar was on the agenda, but… 1599 03:15:14.910 --> 03:15:19.259 Barbara: He wasn't given the opportunity to give his report, and I don't… 1600 03:15:20.270 --> 03:15:22.250 Barbara: I don't understand what we're doing. 1601 03:15:23.990 --> 03:15:28.710 Peter Nagrod: We, we need, we need to make a determination whether we're an RFP or not. 1602 03:15:28.850 --> 03:15:31.539 Mary W: Because it's… What's the timing. 1603 03:15:31.540 --> 03:15:34.210 John Compton: You insist we hear his report, and we'll do that. 1604 03:15:34.210 --> 03:15:34.689 Mary W: I knew that. 1605 03:15:34.690 --> 03:15:40.380 John Compton: Otherwise, you won't be able to, to understand… Completely, what they're recommending. 1606 03:15:43.600 --> 03:15:45.570 Barbara: I don't understand the recommendation. 1607 03:15:47.130 --> 03:15:48.049 Kathy Lehman: I've got an echo. 1608 03:15:48.050 --> 03:15:48.710 Mary W: I go. 1609 03:15:48.710 --> 03:15:49.330 Peter Nagrod: Yeah… 1610 03:15:49.710 --> 03:15:52.679 John Compton: Somebody's, has to turn their own. 1611 03:15:53.280 --> 03:15:54.830 John Compton: I kill everybody. 1612 03:15:55.730 --> 03:15:56.910 John Compton: If I have, have to. 1613 03:15:58.700 --> 03:16:02.690 John Compton: Alright. 1614 03:16:03.030 --> 03:16:03.980 Peter Nagrod: Huh. 1615 03:16:07.510 --> 03:16:14.250 John Compton: All right, is everybody now clear on what we're voting on? We're voting on, on, not… 1616 03:16:15.550 --> 03:16:22.390 John Compton: Using a rigorous vendor Approaching specific vendors for proposals. 1617 03:16:23.670 --> 03:16:30.220 John Compton: Rather than writing up an RFP and distributing, an RFP to vendors. 1618 03:16:30.700 --> 03:16:31.610 Kathy Lehman: That's… 1619 03:16:32.890 --> 03:16:39.320 John Compton: The motion is to not do an RFP for this equipment purchase. 1620 03:16:40.490 --> 03:16:42.829 Barbara: For all the playground equipment purchased? 1621 03:16:42.830 --> 03:16:43.190 Peter Nagrod: No. 1622 03:16:43.190 --> 03:16:44.520 John Compton: Oh, this… 1623 03:16:44.520 --> 03:17:01.549 Oscar Ramos: Can I give you a brief summary of what I was going to show you? Okay, so this is all about the first purchase. We had $30,000 that was budgeted for this fiscal year, and then based on the comprehensive plan, the playground committee, has… we're focusing on the purchase of a train set. 1624 03:17:01.620 --> 03:17:26.250 Oscar Ramos: And we're focusing on the train set instead of a larger piece that we had for older kids, because we're applying for a state grant. We're waiting on the outcome of a state grant application. So, the $30,000 that we have this year, we're focusing in on a train set. And we've gotten one estimate from a train set with various, options. It could be made out of wood, it could be made out of this poly lumber 1625 03:17:26.250 --> 03:17:41.320 Oscar Ramos: material. It could be 6 cars, 7 or 8 cars, or more cars, and so we've got an estimate with one, and I was going to give you just an update of what that looked like, and discuss a little bit about the different materials, the pros and cons of wood versus the recycled plastic, and then 1626 03:17:41.500 --> 03:17:43.630 Oscar Ramos: work for the next month would be… 1627 03:17:43.630 --> 03:18:07.940 Oscar Ramos: that was the big question mark. Is the work for the next month for us to get a couple more estimates and come back with… to you with a comparison of, you know, apples-to-apples comparison over these estimates for different, vendors of this train set? Or our question was, do we do an RFP process instead, and put out a bid, and get… and get, you know, bids on… on RFP? And that's what I was coming here tonight to find out. 1628 03:18:08.030 --> 03:18:11.020 Oscar Ramos: What is the approach that you want us to take over this next month? 1629 03:18:13.330 --> 03:18:14.140 Barbara: Thank you. 1630 03:18:18.580 --> 03:18:19.250 John Compton: Alright. 1631 03:18:19.910 --> 03:18:22.640 John Compton: Thank you, Oscar. I should have allowed you to do that. 1632 03:18:23.490 --> 03:18:25.930 John Compton: Very brief and cogent. 1633 03:18:27.010 --> 03:18:28.849 John Compton: Review of what weapons. 1634 03:18:29.830 --> 03:18:32.510 John Compton: Okay, so we have the motion. 1635 03:18:32.690 --> 03:18:34.720 John Compton: For the Council, any further discussion? 1636 03:18:34.720 --> 03:18:36.700 Barbara: So, so I have a question, like. 1637 03:18:36.880 --> 03:18:46.509 Barbara: what is our authority for not doing an RFP? Like, how do… we just decide when we want to do an RFP and when we don't want to do an RFP? I thought we always had. 1638 03:18:46.510 --> 03:18:51.030 John Compton: requirements for an RFP. There are no requirements for an RFP. 1639 03:18:52.600 --> 03:18:55.449 John Compton: There are requirements for bids. 1640 03:18:57.240 --> 03:19:00.990 John Compton: which I interpret, as proposals. 1641 03:19:01.480 --> 03:19:07.910 John Compton: A proposal is equivalent to a bid. Here, here. For this price, we'll give you… this. 1642 03:19:08.880 --> 03:19:14.490 John Compton: An RFP… what an RFP does is it… we give our specifications. 1643 03:19:14.630 --> 03:19:26.170 John Compton: And they have to provide what we want. And if they don't provide what we want, we can decide whether we're going to go with that or not, but we've already thought out what we want. 1644 03:19:26.390 --> 03:19:29.370 John Compton: And we put it down on paper and distributed it. 1645 03:19:30.290 --> 03:19:34.019 John Compton: to as many… Vendors, as we think. 1646 03:19:34.160 --> 03:19:35.599 John Compton: might be interested. 1647 03:19:36.220 --> 03:19:42.580 John Compton: Whereas the other way is we identify the vendors, go after them, ask for a proposal, and… 1648 03:19:42.920 --> 03:19:54.400 John Compton: If they didn't give enough information, refine the information, and evaluate those proposals, and then decide which one we're… it's still a responsible way, it meets the 1649 03:19:54.560 --> 03:20:05.520 John Compton: it meets the bidding requirement, it just doesn't require the advanced creation of RFP, and if anybody here has written an RFP, you know how long that can take. 1650 03:20:05.520 --> 03:20:06.320 Peter Nagrod: Yes. 1651 03:20:06.840 --> 03:20:07.450 Peter Nagrod: Yes. 1652 03:20:07.450 --> 03:20:18.369 John Compton: Sure, we have a bunch of boilerplates now, but that, for example, the landscaping contract, we wrote an RFP for that, you know, it took us about 2 or 3 months to put that together. 1653 03:20:18.560 --> 03:20:24.229 John Compton: And, you know, now we know we've got it, so we do issue that RFP several times. 1654 03:20:25.290 --> 03:20:28.330 John Compton: Anyway, okay, that's just my opinion about… 1655 03:20:29.060 --> 03:20:36.549 John Compton: about the requirements of the charter, Town's policies versus RFPs. 1656 03:20:37.060 --> 03:20:44.309 Kriss Grisham: Hey, John, could I just mention, when you talk about the charter, it's, you know, it's, general provisions. 1657 03:20:45.010 --> 03:20:48.620 Kriss Grisham: Paragraph 57 that talks about purchasing and contracts. 1658 03:20:48.800 --> 03:20:54.449 Kriss Grisham: And yeah, and there's no mention of RFP. I thought there would be, but there isn't. 1659 03:20:54.560 --> 03:21:03.510 Kriss Grisham: It just talks about getting bids, sealed bids, it talks about, awarding the contract to, 1660 03:21:04.860 --> 03:21:12.100 Kriss Grisham: who offers the lowest of the bids? Quality of work, time of delivery. 1661 03:21:13.230 --> 03:21:22.009 Kriss Grisham: Completion, responsibility of bidders, considered to be, at the Council's And, and mayor's discretion. 1662 03:21:22.490 --> 03:21:27.529 John Compton: Yeah, and it goes on to say, if you don't pick the lowest bidder, you need to. 1663 03:21:27.770 --> 03:21:28.990 John Compton: I could have a region. 1664 03:21:29.850 --> 03:21:30.470 Kriss Grisham: Yeah. 1665 03:21:31.120 --> 03:21:37.799 Kriss Grisham: Yeah, I was surprised not to see RFP in there, like, you know, like, like Barbara was saying, it seems like everything we did had RFPs, but… 1666 03:21:38.660 --> 03:21:42.990 Kriss Grisham: So it's not like we're… we're violating anything. 1667 03:21:42.990 --> 03:21:43.380 Peter Nagrod: No. 1668 03:21:43.380 --> 03:21:45.280 Kriss Grisham: In the town… town charter. 1669 03:21:46.280 --> 03:21:59.270 Peter Nagrod: No. I think John also mentioned that we're basically purchasing a product, not a service, so it's pretty black and white. We know what our product we want to buy is, and we just decide who has the best price, or whatever quality. 1670 03:21:59.270 --> 03:22:05.649 Kriss Grisham: So the thing in the… and again, we're believing this too much, I think, but if you read the charter. 1671 03:22:05.920 --> 03:22:19.450 Kriss Grisham: It doesn't… distinguish any differences. It even says, you know, that it's for, equipment, services. 1672 03:22:19.600 --> 03:22:21.430 Kriss Grisham: It lists it all. 1673 03:22:21.850 --> 03:22:35.409 Kriss Grisham: the biggest difference, I think, is that, you know, there's got to be a way to compare, and that's why I brought up apples to apples. There's got to be some kind of a spec sheet with your wants and needs that everybody could 1674 03:22:35.680 --> 03:22:39.770 Kriss Grisham: The bidders could, could, address, and then that way we could 1675 03:22:39.930 --> 03:22:43.310 Kriss Grisham: look at it equally. You know, you don't want… 1676 03:22:44.920 --> 03:22:54.040 Kriss Grisham: Well, it's up to… it's up to how the playground committee wants to Send out their… So-called bid proposals. 1677 03:22:55.370 --> 03:23:00.990 Kriss Grisham: Some, you know, when it comes back, it's got to be analyzed. And we, the counselors, need to understand 1678 03:23:01.260 --> 03:23:03.550 Kriss Grisham: Right? What's being proposed. 1679 03:23:09.720 --> 03:23:23.979 Barbara: Yeah, so, I'm gonna abstain from voting, because I don't know enough about purchasing. The charter is not the only thing that, sets requirements for the town. There are also state 1680 03:23:23.980 --> 03:23:33.810 Barbara: rules that we need to follow, and at the moment, I don't really… I don't have them in front of me, and I don't know what they are, so I'm not comfortable saying that it's okay to not 1681 03:23:34.440 --> 03:23:42.090 Barbara: send out an RFP, or what the process is. I'm just not familiar enough with it, so I'm gonna abstain from voting on this. 1682 03:23:51.140 --> 03:23:51.749 John Compton: Ready for love? 1683 03:23:52.630 --> 03:23:56.470 Mary W: Well, just… just to say, I mean, I don't know any… all the… 1684 03:23:56.570 --> 03:24:06.510 Mary W: legalities of it at all. I kind of understand the concept of what we're talking about, and we'll vote on that basis, but not in the sense that I understand 1685 03:24:06.820 --> 03:24:08.499 Mary W: All the implications. 1686 03:24:11.850 --> 03:24:13.170 Mary W: Of course, I'm aware. 1687 03:24:13.170 --> 03:24:13.760 John Compton: Fair enough. 1688 03:24:13.760 --> 03:24:14.290 Mary W: That's up. 1689 03:24:14.550 --> 03:24:15.070 John Compton: Somebody. 1690 03:24:16.530 --> 03:24:17.720 John Compton: They're audio. 1691 03:24:18.380 --> 03:24:20.769 John Compton: And it's a change from what it was. 1692 03:24:22.810 --> 03:24:34.490 John Compton: As far as I am aware, all these years, I have never seen or heard any state requirement telling a municipality how they spend their money. 1693 03:24:34.860 --> 03:24:41.830 John Compton: Except for very… particular… unique situations. 1694 03:24:42.770 --> 03:24:49.780 John Compton: So, we're not… with that, we're not subject to anybody telling us how to determine 1695 03:24:50.200 --> 03:25:08.449 John Compton: how we… how we engage in contracts, or whatever. We have a town attorney, we have, our charter, and we certainly have town policies and procedures, the council, probably, in this case. I mean, if people are going to start asking this question? 1696 03:25:08.930 --> 03:25:15.879 John Compton: then it's one more policy and procedure that the Council should adopt, but this is how we are going to 1697 03:25:16.850 --> 03:25:19.500 John Compton: to do purchasing. 1698 03:25:19.900 --> 03:25:22.029 John Compton: Of whatever it is. 1699 03:25:22.170 --> 03:25:30.419 John Compton: And we can have alternatives. I mean, you can simply say, look, you can do it this way, or you can do it that way. Or in this case, you have to do it this way. 1700 03:25:30.750 --> 03:25:44.919 John Compton: I mean, it could just be a decision of the Council to do it that way, and right now, I'd call it a policy and procedure. I would not encumber that. And that's a resolution, by the way. Policies and procedures, we are not by resolution. I would… 1701 03:25:45.440 --> 03:25:51.230 John Compton: Avoid, like, the plague, putting this in an ordinance, which has… It's cumbersome. 1702 03:25:51.450 --> 03:25:53.360 John Compton: Requirements. 1703 03:25:53.780 --> 03:25:54.540 John Compton: adopting. 1704 03:25:55.280 --> 03:26:01.300 John Compton: Either way, it's just as… just as… Just as effective at… 1705 03:26:03.350 --> 03:26:09.329 John Compton: describing what the town should do, and it would live on beyond this council, beyond this mayor, beyond everybody. 1706 03:26:09.830 --> 03:26:13.509 John Compton: This is the way we were doing it up till now. If you don't like it, change. 1707 03:26:15.340 --> 03:26:18.170 Peter Nagrod: But we have… We have… 1708 03:26:18.170 --> 03:26:22.020 John Compton: somewhere, some… there's some version of this somewhere, I know that. 1709 03:26:22.020 --> 03:26:35.009 Peter Nagrod: somewhere it says that if it's over $5,000, you do an RFP. I've been… I've been, you know, we've been doing that forever. Is that just lore, or is that a fact? 1710 03:26:35.410 --> 03:26:37.400 John Compton: No, that's… I think it's in the charter. 1711 03:26:38.430 --> 03:26:42.699 Peter Nagrod: Now, that's… what… does it say 5,000 in the chart? I don't think so. We've always… 1712 03:26:42.700 --> 03:26:44.119 Kathy Lehman: That's what I don't have it with me. 1713 03:26:44.120 --> 03:26:52.070 Kriss Grisham: It does. It says, all expenditures for supplies, tutorials, equipment, construction of public Improvements… 1714 03:26:52.310 --> 03:27:01.340 Kriss Grisham: Or, contract, contractual services involving more than $5,000 must be made on written contract. 1715 03:27:02.360 --> 03:27:17.389 Kriss Grisham: Right? It doesn't say our… you know, and then it goes on and says, as a clerk is required to ask for sealed bids in some manner, as may be prescribed by ordinance or such, written contracts provided. However. 1716 03:27:17.740 --> 03:27:24.880 Kriss Grisham: The Council may authorize bypassing of any Or all bid procedures, 1717 03:27:25.260 --> 03:27:33.059 Kriss Grisham: Now, our bid procedures steps in cases in which the sealed bid process may not produce Responsive bids. 1718 03:27:33.580 --> 03:27:36.609 Kriss Grisham: It does go on to say that it's 1719 03:27:37.000 --> 03:27:43.830 Kriss Grisham: talks about contracts. The whole thing is contracts. Such written contracts must be awarded to the bidder who offers the lowest 1720 03:27:43.990 --> 03:27:48.620 Kriss Grisham: or best, best bid, quality of GERD's work. 1721 03:27:48.820 --> 03:27:56.289 Kriss Grisham: time of delivery, completion, responsibility of bidders being considered. 1722 03:27:56.800 --> 03:28:00.749 Kriss Grisham: That's all it says, and this is… this is… this is the town charter. 1723 03:28:02.010 --> 03:28:04.560 Kriss Grisham: And, you know, and I… 1724 03:28:04.690 --> 03:28:11.260 Kriss Grisham: The only thing is, is… and again, I can't emphasize enough, you know, we have to go out with something, and it sounds like, you know. 1725 03:28:12.980 --> 03:28:14.150 Kriss Grisham: Oscar. 1726 03:28:14.510 --> 03:28:25.110 Kriss Grisham: plans on doing that, you know, because if you go out with, hey, I want a train set in this case, you know, you're gonna come back with all kinds of weird stuff. 1727 03:28:25.310 --> 03:28:33.719 Kriss Grisham: And it's gonna have to go through Council approval for the expenditures, and if it's not what the Council is happy with, any… 1728 03:28:34.930 --> 03:28:35.879 Kriss Grisham: you know… 1729 03:28:36.350 --> 03:28:46.569 Kriss Grisham: one of us, or multiple… a multitude of us, then it's going to be shot down. So, you know, it's best to go out with a set of 1730 03:28:46.760 --> 03:28:49.389 Kriss Grisham: Wants and needs, 1731 03:28:49.910 --> 03:28:58.129 Kriss Grisham: For the bidders to come back, so that we could all look at it collectively as counselors to feel comfortable with what we want to be… 1732 03:28:58.130 --> 03:29:03.499 Peter Nagrod: Yeah. I approve it. We can do that. So, can we vote? And see where we're at? 1733 03:29:06.770 --> 03:29:10.790 John Compton: We're still discussing. If somebody wants to call the question, we can cut the… 1734 03:29:11.260 --> 03:29:13.580 John Compton: That's a discussion short, but . 1735 03:29:13.770 --> 03:29:16.210 Peter Nagrod: I mean, we could talk forever on… because… 1736 03:29:16.470 --> 03:29:17.840 John Compton: Apparently, we can. 1737 03:29:18.230 --> 03:29:18.820 Peter Nagrod: Yeah. 1738 03:29:18.820 --> 03:29:26.969 John Compton: I just want… I just want to throw out, I mean… Oh, no. Statements, statements notwithstanding, that have been made in the last 15 minutes. 1739 03:29:27.260 --> 03:29:33.909 John Compton: I really know of no incidents that I am aware of over many, many years. 1740 03:29:34.140 --> 03:29:37.549 John Compton: Where a purchase has been done in the town. 1741 03:29:38.050 --> 03:29:40.180 John Compton: In some sort of… 1742 03:29:41.230 --> 03:29:45.460 John Compton: you know, Attempt to bypass 1743 03:29:45.850 --> 03:29:59.749 John Compton: fiduciary responsibility, or low bid process, or substandard quality, whatever. I simply don't know of anything, and I, you know, I kind of feel like citing 1744 03:30:01.050 --> 03:30:05.620 John Compton: The idea, you know, this town has operated rather well. 1745 03:30:05.780 --> 03:30:14.979 John Compton: Without checking off the 20… Formalities that must be followed in… with everything, and so… 1746 03:30:15.230 --> 03:30:18.379 John Compton: It really is counterproductive to question 1747 03:30:18.570 --> 03:30:23.229 John Compton: Whether we're… we're spending money on a playground piece of equipment. 1748 03:30:23.640 --> 03:30:28.910 John Compton: responsibly if we bypass the RFP process. 1749 03:30:29.490 --> 03:30:35.629 John Compton: There are a lot more specific things to think about to spend the money 1750 03:30:36.130 --> 03:30:39.410 John Compton: responsibly than to be using an RFV. 1751 03:30:39.520 --> 03:30:43.259 John Compton: Unless you think… You know, we're overspending. 1752 03:30:43.710 --> 03:30:46.979 John Compton: That's… that's what the RP's designed, to get you the lowest bid. 1753 03:30:47.600 --> 03:30:48.330 John Compton: Okay. 1754 03:30:50.630 --> 03:30:54.659 John Compton: All right, so I'll… are we gonna vote on, this, then? 1755 03:30:55.500 --> 03:30:56.669 John Compton: All in favor? 1756 03:30:57.650 --> 03:31:01.800 John Compton: I passed the RFP, Opposed? Abstain. 1757 03:31:02.660 --> 03:31:04.600 John Compton: I've abstained. Okay. 1758 03:31:04.850 --> 03:31:07.760 Kathy Lehman: I couldn't see those numbers, John. Can you give that to me? 1759 03:31:07.760 --> 03:31:11.670 John Compton: It's 4 in favor, no opposed, 1 absent. 1760 03:31:12.930 --> 03:31:13.739 Kathy Lehman: Thank you. 1761 03:31:15.890 --> 03:31:16.510 John Compton: Alright. 1762 03:31:17.200 --> 03:31:18.860 John Compton: Town Council reports. 1763 03:31:19.120 --> 03:31:26.769 John Compton: There are a few things that were actually, worth, worth… I mean, they're always worth seeing, but… 1764 03:31:26.940 --> 03:31:42.150 John Compton: you know, are going to hit the council in the fairly near future. The first one is roads. We, we've had a policy for the last bunch of years of doing road work every other year. 1765 03:31:42.220 --> 03:31:54.459 John Compton: And we've combined the budgets of two fiscal years to… into one, you know, project, to do repairs around town. This is one of those years. 1766 03:31:54.510 --> 03:32:03.240 John Compton: So, we need a new road RFP. In this case, we need an RFP, because we're going to specify exactly what we want. 1767 03:32:03.310 --> 03:32:04.070 John Compton: to work. 1768 03:32:04.230 --> 03:32:05.050 Kathy Lehman: Who… 1769 03:32:05.050 --> 03:32:06.960 John Compton: To, consist of. 1770 03:32:07.090 --> 03:32:25.500 John Compton: And we also have a template, so it's just a matter of plugging in what do we want this time? So, that needs to be done, and the idea is to get the work, done in June or, in early July. You can… you can entail the money across the, fiscal years, 1771 03:32:25.710 --> 03:32:37.829 John Compton: And the main thing in the way of doing that is to assess the condition of the roads in town to prioritize where to do resurfacing. 1772 03:32:38.330 --> 03:32:40.999 John Compton: So, I have a… 1773 03:32:41.950 --> 03:32:44.640 Kathy Lehman: spreadsheet, which I created, which… 1774 03:32:44.640 --> 03:32:48.610 John Compton: Talks about lots and lots of the road segments, all of the roads. 1775 03:32:48.820 --> 03:32:59.590 John Compton: broken… sometimes broken down. And so, I'm going to look around… look around town and assess the… where… where, you know, what… what… what areas need a… some… some… 1776 03:33:00.270 --> 03:33:04.560 John Compton: What condition they're in, and anyone else who would like to do that? 1777 03:33:05.150 --> 03:33:09.370 John Compton: Is welcome to do that, so that we can, we can, 1778 03:33:09.560 --> 03:33:13.470 John Compton: Have a meeting in the minds as to what to produce for the work. 1779 03:33:14.090 --> 03:33:16.169 John Compton: Coming, in this RFP. 1780 03:33:16.330 --> 03:33:22.329 Peter Nagrod: So, John, if we change the name of the basketball court to Basketball Court Lane. 1781 03:33:22.720 --> 03:33:25.020 Peter Nagrod: Can we get that paved? 1782 03:33:30.990 --> 03:33:33.629 John Compton: Anything's possible, but… 1783 03:33:35.190 --> 03:33:36.160 Peter Nagrod: Alright. 1784 03:33:36.160 --> 03:33:40.249 John Compton: I wouldn't like to see that… yeah, right. Well, we'll work on that, Peter. 1785 03:33:40.250 --> 03:33:41.080 Peter Nagrod: Okay. 1786 03:33:42.480 --> 03:33:51.130 John Compton: Okay, the, the Planning Commission and the Historic Preservation Commission, both reports by Barbara and Peter. 1787 03:33:51.440 --> 03:34:05.990 John Compton: Mention the… an ordinance revision is being considered to create a historic preservation waiver… option in the approval of permits. 1788 03:34:06.170 --> 03:34:13.259 John Compton: It's, I briefly described my understanding of it with the help of Georgette. 1789 03:34:13.420 --> 03:34:31.349 John Compton: in the agenda under this section. It would allow a property owner to apply for a preservation waiver if a renovation project meets the criteria in the HPC design guidelines, zoning ordinances, and comprehensive plan. 1790 03:34:31.780 --> 03:34:40.599 John Compton: But would otherwise be rejected due to setback restrictions or other zoning restrictions that disallow the proposed obstruction. 1791 03:34:42.030 --> 03:34:49.429 John Compton: That's a lot. Let's not even think about it tonight, but it's going to be coming, I think, as a proposed ordinance. 1792 03:34:49.430 --> 03:34:50.230 Peter Nagrod: Right. 1793 03:34:52.420 --> 03:34:54.620 John Compton: It's actually supposed to make life easier. 1794 03:34:55.120 --> 03:34:55.600 John Compton: Forever. 1795 03:34:57.090 --> 03:35:05.549 John Compton: So, it's not… Alright, the Historic Preservation Commission, we just heard about the archiving project, 1796 03:35:05.800 --> 03:35:12.550 John Compton: from Bob, so, that was, that's, what's going on from them. 1797 03:35:12.730 --> 03:35:20.210 John Compton: And, the light committee is worth mentioning, because, with Mary's, active… 1798 03:35:20.360 --> 03:35:24.469 John Compton: efforts, the light committee, met. 1799 03:35:24.610 --> 03:35:32.920 John Compton: And, somebody was, stepped willingly up to become the chair, right, Mary? 1800 03:35:32.920 --> 03:35:35.619 Peter Nagrod: So, Steven Hansen has agreed to be… Yes, yes. 1801 03:35:35.620 --> 03:35:37.680 John Compton: Well, no, I'll probably know that already. 1802 03:35:37.970 --> 03:35:48.450 John Compton: And they've discussed the need for a policy and procedure document, which they're going to be working on. But, Tom Land did leave. 1803 03:35:48.550 --> 03:36:03.119 John Compton: The committee with a large checklist, a timeline, and a whole bunch of stuff that should… they should be able to continue their, their excellent work. 1804 03:36:05.800 --> 03:36:25.089 Peter Nagrod: John, sorry, but this is my last… I was gonna… I had to bring this up because of the timing… it's the timing with the budget, is that the major thing that was discussed at the REC Committee meeting was, unanimously, we voted on, getting porta-potties this year. 1805 03:36:25.380 --> 03:36:30.780 Peter Nagrod: And I don't need to go into, you know, why we need to have those at the lake, it's ridiculous. 1806 03:36:30.780 --> 03:36:33.490 John Compton: At your house, you're responsible for your own plumbing. 1807 03:36:33.620 --> 03:36:34.630 Peter Nagrod: Yeah, right. 1808 03:36:34.830 --> 03:36:48.260 Peter Nagrod: So any… no, but… but so… so the council… so is that something that… it's gonna be, like, it's under $5,000, doesn't need an RFP. Is that something that the council needs to vote on, or can we just, like, put that in the budget? 1809 03:36:49.560 --> 03:36:52.890 John Compton: You are talking about the rec committee and porta-potties. 1810 03:36:52.890 --> 03:36:57.060 Peter Nagrod: I'm sorry, Lake Committee, like, oh, Lake, sorry about that, guys. 1811 03:36:57.210 --> 03:37:05.269 Peter Nagrod: It's late. Okay, no, the late committee. The rec committee wants it, too, because of the, somewhere in the parks there. 1812 03:37:05.270 --> 03:37:06.430 John Compton: Alright. 1813 03:37:06.430 --> 03:37:13.000 Peter Nagrod: and swimming. No, but it's something that… it's under… it's, like, under about $3,500, probably. 1814 03:37:13.000 --> 03:37:15.230 John Compton: This is for the budget meeting. It's a good… 1815 03:37:15.230 --> 03:37:24.359 Peter Nagrod: Okay, but… but… who's gonna make that… is that something that the council wants to… I mean, it's a major change at the lake, and so… 1816 03:37:25.380 --> 03:37:31.080 Peter Nagrod: I mean, if you're fine with it, and we'll pass it, that's fine, but if the council needs to vote on it, now's the time to do it. 1817 03:37:31.080 --> 03:37:45.199 John Compton: has to pass it. It can be put into the budget by the council, the town has to adopt the budget, and then has to execute. I mean, then we have to, you know, where are they gonna go, and who's gonna maintain them, and… 1818 03:37:45.200 --> 03:37:45.740 Peter Nagrod: Right. 1819 03:37:45.740 --> 03:37:47.760 John Compton: All kinds of operational stuff. 1820 03:37:47.970 --> 03:37:52.359 Peter Nagrod: Yeah, it's all done. Okay. Okay. Alright, that's fine, yeah, thank you. Yeah. 1821 03:37:52.610 --> 03:37:53.849 John Compton: Not a bad idea. 1822 03:37:54.490 --> 03:37:55.300 Peter Nagrod: Oh, done. 1823 03:37:56.500 --> 03:37:59.960 John Compton: So I… are they gonna have… Nia, you know… 1824 03:38:00.210 --> 03:38:06.390 John Compton: Little red… red and green lights if they're occupied… I'm joking. It's got… it's getting late. 1825 03:38:06.390 --> 03:38:07.650 Kathy Lehman: Alright, that's it. 1826 03:38:08.300 --> 03:38:11.999 John Compton: Does anybody else have anything to say about their report that they wish to communicate? 1827 03:38:14.130 --> 03:38:16.350 John Compton: Anybody have anything else to say at all? 1828 03:38:17.790 --> 03:38:30.849 John Compton: All right, well, the next meeting is two weeks from tonight. It will be the budget work session. It will have, Oscar's presentation about the specific playground equipment. 1829 03:38:30.850 --> 03:38:41.030 John Compton: They have an action on this, resolution, if it's put together, but I suspect, you know, it might be… it might not happen until April. 1830 03:38:41.440 --> 03:38:43.360 John Compton: And there was something else. 1831 03:38:44.090 --> 03:38:48.010 John Compton: Right? It may come up, for, 1832 03:38:48.470 --> 03:38:54.280 John Compton: as business at the meeting. Otherwise, it'll be about… about, about the budget. 1833 03:38:54.560 --> 03:38:55.600 John Compton: proposed budget. 1834 03:38:55.850 --> 03:38:59.670 John Compton: And then the regular council meeting, of course, on April 13th. 1835 03:39:01.780 --> 03:39:03.230 Peter Nagrod: Oof. Wow. 1836 03:39:03.640 --> 03:39:10.580 John Compton: Okay, well, thanks, everybody, for hanging in, on this. Lots of, you know, some more 1837 03:39:11.500 --> 03:39:21.259 John Compton: It's always tough when we have procedural issues. Just, you know, and it's difficult to deal with vandalism and 1838 03:39:21.410 --> 03:39:22.590 John Compton: Stuff like that. 1839 03:39:23.740 --> 03:39:29.920 John Compton: Really hard to… figure out… I think the group… you guys, thanks for volunteering for that. 1840 03:39:31.700 --> 03:39:32.520 Kathy Lehman: you know. 1841 03:39:32.630 --> 03:39:33.779 John Compton: She is really… 1842 03:39:33.780 --> 03:39:34.100 Kathy Lehman: Good runner. 1843 03:39:34.100 --> 03:39:35.070 John Compton: anything, there are any… 1844 03:39:35.220 --> 03:39:35.760 Kathy Lehman: Fashion. 1845 03:39:37.090 --> 03:39:39.759 Kathy Lehman: Introducing these, I'm sorry. 1846 03:39:41.590 --> 03:39:43.250 John Compton: Okay, thanks, everybody. 1847 03:39:43.260 --> 03:39:45.770 Peter Nagrod: Thank you. Good night, everybody. 1848 03:39:47.220 --> 03:39:48.210 Kathy Lehman: See ya!